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Comment by makeitshine | Hacker News Reader

For many older people it died in the 90s. When people stopped dancing and treated the DJ like it was a concert I felt it had changed into something else. I watch some of the old VHS I took and people are crowding the speakers and the floor is alive, while nowadays so much of what I see is people all facing a DJ lit up by a spotlight and just standing their bobbing their head.

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"it wasn't better back then, you were just younger" - unknown internet pundit

In my city for a national holiday we used to have an absolute massive unrestricted party everywhere uptown.

You'd wake up in a tree somewhere and everyone was friendly as hell. Volunteers would pick up afterwards.

Then a new mayor came in and ruined it all, locked it down, limited the area and basically killed the spirit of it.

I was younger sure but it was so much better. Applies to lots of things that get ruined.

since it's not a thing anymore, can you share which city?

They actually were better back then which is what drives people crazy. I think it’s because the older generations (us) didn’t put any value in tradition, so we weren’t able to preserve ours.

Your logic requires, it seems, that things have been getting worse for ever.

Or is there some point where you think cohort "value in tradition" was different?

How do you infer such a generalization when the OP was referring to something very specific?

It's possible for them to believe that the techno/rave/DJ scene is worse now, and that other similar culture/social activities done now are not.

I really hate this meme. A lot of things really were better in the past. Website user interfaces are a big example here. Conversely, some other things are much better now; cigarette smoking rates are a big example.

It does seem to imply that nothing ever changes culturally which is of course false. That said, fellow olds do often seem to put on the rose tinted glasses for anything that happened in their youth so it’s a good reminder all the same.

Well, yes.

SF had many more fun venues when SOMA was underutilized industrial real estate available to promoters and artists. A counterculture needs cheap space.

A promoter friend told me after the first dot-com crash that half the twentysomethings had left SF and the other half were working their butts off to survive.

Which is why I specified for older people who lived through the early scene. Kids today will create their own unique scenes while others will milk the nostalgia of past ones.

I was standing there bobbing my head in the 90s. It's tough being a pioneer.

The new generation have ruined their generation being unlike the older ones, alas!

Some things do change for the worse, others for the better. Smaller, more tight knit communities, like raves were in the 80s and early 90s were, in my mind, better than the predominately business-oriented DJ-festishization parties of today. There are good parties still going on, but it's not the primary mover of the rave scene like it once was.

Kids these days may not need those scenes as much these days, since they're more open to people who are different. Much of the early rave scene was for people that didn't fit in, for whatever reason.

“Kids these days” - My toddler, 30 years from now

Those places very much still exist. I've been to plenty this year. They are just not very well represented on social media, surprise.

I see a lot of issues with phones as many people say, but you go to KitKat on your average night and you see plenty of people dancing.

I've never been to KitKat, though I've been past it a few times. Given the reputation, I'd be surprised if they ever allowed cameras or devices with them.

They don't allow phones past the cloakroom in Kitkat, and pretty much anyone in there will immediately challenge anyone who sneaks one past. All the other clubs tend to just have stickers over the cameras, and will still kick anyone out who's seen to be videoing or taking photos.

When people stopped dancing and treated the DJ like it was a concert I felt it had changed into something else

That might have happened in some particular scenes, but:

- the exact same thing kept on going, maybe shifted a bit to more underground things; I don't know what type of parties you are referring to, but the stuff I frequent has been using the same principle for a long time: it is often so that one cannot even see the DJ because they're covered in the decoration and/or the DJ is in the back of the place and people dance to the speakers in the front

- not all concerts are the same. I get what you mean about 'DJ in the spotlight' which is just somewhat saddening especially if they're just pushing some buttons or even faking it, but at least for me there is something about proper interaction between DJ or band and the crowd which I also really like. I have fond memories of small parties where we'd be going crazy in front of the DJ because they'd build this really nice story in the mix where we'd knew what was coming and they know we knew and that would lead to an even better feeling of togetherness. So even though they're in the front they'd actually be part of the crowd as well.

> while nowadays so much of what I see

there's your problem, you're not there.

there are other things happening in the crowd. all you see are tall guys with the longest arms holding up their phones taking videos of other phones.

Which is exactly the crap that Berghain is protecting itself from with it's strict door policy. The dancefloor is pure sound, the DJ is visible but not the center.

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