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Comment by notafraudster | Hacker News Reader

Since the article doesn't say, is there an economic reason why EV adoption is so high? More aggressive subsidies for new purchases? Or solely driven by expensive gasoline?

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It looks like Norwegian fees on imports are pretty crazy, on top of the 25% VAT. All of which is waived for EVs. The import fees seem to be composed of several sub-fees such as HP tax, weight tax, CO2 tax... I can't tell what the number since it varies is but guessing over 50% of the base price on average. If someone offered me a car with a 75% discount you can bet I'd buy it EV or not ;)

There is no tax on EVs, but a lot of tax on fossils :)

You also get some other incentives but they are in the process of being phased out now.

Just as an example compared to the neighbour country:

The base model Y price in Norway is 534'000 NOK (~52'000€) while in Sweden 719'900 SEK (~70'700€).

For non EV cars it's usually the other way round.

So are people from Sweden or elsewhere buying them in Norway?

No they need to pay taxes when importing so it doesn't quite work that way.

Besides the incentives, I think a lot have realized that fossil fueled cars cannot be part of our future.

A lot of Norwegians can charge at home, and with the range of the new generation of EV's the main obstacle has been passed[1].

This makes buying an ICE car a risky prospect, given that future CO2 taxes and such can make gas prices much higher, driving down the resale value.

We live in the city and have a BWM i3, and there's zero chance our next vehicle will be anything but a pure EV.

[1]: https://www.nrk.no/vestland/renate-folgjer-den-grone-straume...

You don't have to pay the usual 25% sales tax, and you can drive in bus lanes, and tolls are 0-50% of what normal cars pay

I was thinking the same. The Y is a great EV, it is also a $53K+ vehicle.

There's a LOT of people who would happily be driving an EV right now but their last gas guzzler wast less than half that cost. How can Norwegians swing their local equivalent of $53K for any vehicle EV or not?

There has to be more going on here economically/financially.

They actually make car buyers chip in to pay for the negative externalities of burning dinosaur bones.

Here in Indiana I pay an EV tax to make up for lost gas tax revenue, literally the opposite of what should happen.

EVs are heavier than normal cars and you are using the road. So, it is fair to pay the road tax. Assuming the money collected for this directly goes to road maintenance.

I do not have problem with paying taxes that go for roads. Even though in my case I own PHEVs than BEVs. That would be last of my complains.

The effects of climate change are expected to be a lot more expensive than road maintenance, so I think the tax is still the wrong way around.

I would have agreed if EVs had no Carbon footprint.

Heavier part is not significant. The weight effect on road wear is like a 4th order effect. 1 semi-truck causes something like 100,000 the road wear of a single heavy EV. I am fine if we want to tax this route, but disel is now going to cost $300 a gallon for trucks.

If road use taxes on EV's like Indiana's were legitimate then they would be applying them equally to all vehicles and either lowering the fuel excise in response or keeping it there as a carbon tax but since they apply only to EV's they are almost certainly the result of legislators bowing to their fossil fuel lobby donors.

The average salary is close to the equivalent of $55000 and median is a bit over $50000, that helps.

The fossils are also taxed heavily, the Audi Q7 for instance starts at over 1.1 million NOK, the Model Y starts at 550k or so.

In comparison I bought my previous car (Toyota Avensis with 150 hp engine) in 2011 for 400k NOK.

Then you have the fuel costs which is at around 16-18 NOK/liter, which comes out to about $7-8/us gallon and electricity is about 1 NOK/kWh. For an efficient fossil (5 liter/100km) it costs 1.5 NOK/km in fuel costs, the same for an EV is 0.25 NOK/km when charging at home depending on the efficiency. My ioniq costs even less.

I drive a Model X (with a refresh X on order) and a classic ioniq electric myself, buying a new fossil here is just dumb at this point.

I'd also add that public transport in Norway is excellent.

Cars in Norway have always been very expensive, so for Norwegians $40-50k is just what a new entry level car costs. Compared what else you can buy for $50k, the Model Y is bit of a bargain. An 'equivalent' gasoline powered Audi/BMW etc. would cost in excess of $100k.

> How can Norwegians swing their local equivalent of $53K for any vehicle EV or not?

Norway is a very rich country - I don't think $53k is a barrier to most people there.

Norway is a very rich country, but I'd also point out that despite their wealth they have substantially fewer cars per capita (~0.5) than the US (~0.8). Less wealthy European countries like Portugal and Lithuania have about as many cars per capita as Norway, likely due to the relatively high prices of cars and fuel in Norway. Basically, if ICE cars and gasoline weren't heavily taxed in Norway, and Norwegians could cheaply drive around in Subaru Outbacks and Toyota Corollas, a lot more of them probably would.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_vehicles_...

You're right but I think it's a little bit more complex than that. Switzerland is equally wealthy (or even more, if you look at disposable income) and here you can definitely buy a $3000 Subaru Outback and drive around in the Alps every weekend, yet car ownership is similar to Norway's, because it's a hassle when the train and public transportation network is good and convenient.

Maybe without all these taxes, car ownership in Norway would be a bit higher (like in Finland) but I don't think it would reach the US number. Lots of the Norwegian population is concentrated in urbanized areas, and some have gone car-free.

Even though there are few incentives in Switzerland, we see plenty of Teslas, because of course for some people $60k in a car is nothing. But that's definitely above average, and not everyone is able or willing to spend that much.

Public transport in Norway is so good that there is less need for car ownership.

Cars are very heavily taxed in Norway. The EV's are barely taxed at all. A Tesla Model 3 is close to the cheapest new car you can buy.

EV's pay much less for toll roads. I think it used to be free.

Gasoline is heavily taxed. The price is currently close to 9$/gallon.

I am in US where gasoline is way too cheap than it should be. I am still going to buy Model Y (or X) simply because it is a great car (fun to drive, over the air updates, autopilot, etc)

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