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Comment by JackFr | Hacker News Reader

When I read about these scams, I always wonder how do the scammers justify this to themselves? I can’t believe there are that many true sociopaths completely lacking in empathy. And I believe no one is the bad guy in their own narrative. Do they convince themselves that they’re not really harming “rich people who don’t need all that money” or that their own situations are so extreme that they “need” to steal for their own survival. Or they just don’t think of stealing as an act with any moral weight.

Or possibly I just have too sanguine view of humanity.

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I've heard an interesting take from an assistant to a lawyer who helped someone defrauded of money.

    Nobody ever wakes up in the morning and says, "What I am going to do today is evil, and I'm okay with that."
    When I thought through each of the examples of society-wide atrocities,
    examining them through the new lens I had gained in that deposition room,
    immediately I saw it: In every single case where people cooperated with evil, they used eloquent lies to assure
    themselves that what they were doing was actually good.

I once got hold of the dutch book 'vuile jatten, schone handen' from A. De Rooi. I always wondered about the degree of reality of the book, but it might show part of what's going on.

In the book, a boy -the author- suffers severe neglect and betrayal, and grows up a criminal. Thief, mostly. His motives are complex.

He tends to see others as prey, there is the passion for the chase, he is fascinated by the criminal side of life. He seems quite smart and inventive, thinks his crimes through, but does not care too much about morals. Prison is a risk of the job. Otoh, close friends and partners are respected and can trust him.

It was a strange, interesting mix. I nevertheless hope I never meet the author.

> I always wonder how do the scammers justify this to themselves

Scammers rarely work alone.

For most, it's just a job. One that pays decently well. In most cases the companies(yes, companies) involved maintain the appearances of a normal call center, with sales targets and everything.

One such scam company was even providing Japanese language training, so they could target a market that's less disputed.

Indeed, and commission sales is a heck of a drug. If you need money, and a company is paying you to sell people a product... you may find yourself selling products you don't really believe in in a call center, where you know the person buying isn't really getting a good deal. Only a tiny step further to actively trying to take their money for a nice bump in your commission check.

Add that your scam call center employee might have family to feed, and suddenly scamming the rich senior's retirement fund seems like a minor transgression...

You do have to have a skewed moral compass – to the point that they will continue the scam even if the learn the victim has disabilities.

But not as skewed as the ones running the whole operation.

Never underestimate the power of poverty and desperation.

Same reason that thieves don't care about the damage to their victims, or oil companies don't/didn't care about global warming

Their thoughts:

If I don't do it someone else will.

If they're dumb enough to fall for it, they deserved it.

1. Victims are evil or citizens of an evil country. They built their wealth exploiting scammer's country.

2. Victims are insured, they will get their money back from their government.

After spending over five years moving through Latin America and Africa, I have a slightly different view of the "developed world" than most who live in it.

I personally think what the scammers are doing is no more morally corrupt than Nike paying workers fifty cents an hour to make a pair of shoes for $2 than they sell for $400, or health insurance companies denying coverage to people literally dying in the name of profits.

All of the above (and scammers) are extremely morally corrupt and "wrong", the only difference is some of them have been normalized.

Some are sociopaths and don't care.

Some think that everyone in the target country they're calling is rich and/or insured and/or will get reimbursed by their government anyway, so it's more like shoplifting (from an insurance company or the government) than stealing from a person.

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