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Learning the minute details of weight training, nutrition, and other (important!) subjects is for marginal gains on top of a base level of fitness which the majority of the population lacks.

This point cannot be stressed enough! I've been strength training for years and have seen way to many people over think what needs to be done. Friends who just start working out come to me with questions like 'what if I miss a rep on my workout' or 'should I use avocado oil instead of olive oil'? Huh? It's not that complicated. In fact it's quite simple.

Learn enough to do the basic exercises safely and then...GO DO THEM! When you can do them with a certain weight, add more weight. Repeat. As an aside, a close second to the first point is to log everything. It's hard to improve if you're not measuring.

The problem is the same one that comes up with diets. People are looking for an easier solution when there simply isn't one. The person who gets to the gym and busts their ass a few times/week will be way ahead than the guy stuck sitting on his computer researching the best way to do finger curls[1].

[1] And another pet peeve. Skinny guys doing 20 sets of curls. Please go buy a book like mentioned above and just follow a workout from it. If you're doing enough pulling like you should, curls can usually be skipped all together.

I highly endorse the above. Most people fall into the same trap as careless developers trying to optimize a program: they focus on what is easy, instead of what will make the largest difference.

I would only modify one your post in one way:

    < As an aside, a close second to the first point is to log everything.
    > As an aside, a close second to the first point is to LOG EVERYTHING.

As a minor addition, after you have engaged in the "GO DO THEM" and the "LOG EVERYTHING" part for a while, you'll notice when you reach a plateau. This is the time when asking for help/interneting/optimizing is helpful. Usually I'm not eating enough, your mistakes may vary.

One more tip: most of the big guys at the gym are friendly. If one of them asks to work in, let him, and ask him to watch your form during your sets.

One more tip: most of the big guys at the gym are friendly. If one of them asks to work in, let him, and ask him to watch your form during your sets.

Most people at the gym are either itimidated by, or presume that the biggest, buff guys are the most unfriendly.

The fact of the matter is, they have put a lot of time and effort into something they enjoy or are good at and are more than willing to help out with advice.

If you feel you're doing something wrong, or not sure .. just go and ask.

But be aware that lots of people at the gyms (especially including employees) are doing the exercises with bad form, or concentrate on the wrong things (i.e. endless curls, and you almost never see squats).

Get a book like `Starting Strength'. Then talk to the guys in the gym. There are generally helpful---but it's useful to have non-bullshit source to compare their suggestions with.

Good point, results do tend to speak for themselves .. a guy with pins for legs and gorilla arms obviously wouldn't be a good starting point for squat technique

Yes. And some people may take steroids, so they get strong without needing much proper stimulus.

I don't think this is true. My understanding is that steroids speed up your recovery phase - you can work out 7 days/week (and make commensurate gains) instead of simply 3 days + 4 recovery days.

They certainly don't prevent you from destroying your back during a deadlift with poor form.

What about the stuff that makes cows gets muscles while just standing in the stables?

You are correct. Steroids allow the user to work harder and more often.

With weight training, for example, not worrying about the details and just doing it might lead to serious injury. You need to do these exercises with proper form. And if you're an out of shape computer geek, you will almost certainly need to fix your posterior chain and upper back before you are ready to do deadlift, squat, bench, and shoulder press safely.

You can squat, deadlift, bench and shoulder press on your first day. Here is a simple, two step process to start squatting:

1. Stand up.

2. Squat.

Oh, there's a lot more to it. And some people actually find air squats harder than weighted squats because there's no counter-balance. But the basic powerlifter movements - squat, deadlift, bench - can be done by people on their first day as long as they use very little weight. In fact, I think it's best to start with those movements to build strength. Having someone to correct your form is good, of course, but not everyone has that luxury and may have to monitor themselves. That's doable as well.

The idea that proper form is self evident or intuitively learned is naive, especially in regard to people whose daily responsibilities don't demand much coordination. If you want to look good for a few years, then yes, you can develop muscle by just going through the motions, but you run a very big risk of systemic injury. I highly recommend anyone looking to get in shape start with a few sessions with a personal trainer who can give feedback on form.

It's not intuitive nor self evident. But a motivated beginner can learn on their own - I did. I read a lot, watched videos, and paid close attention to my own form. I would have done better with an instructor, but that was not an option. Most "personal trainers" I saw knew nothing about basic, free weight lifts.

What I'm trying to dispel is the notion that you shouldn't touch free weights or that free weights are for experienced people only. Use very low weight in the beginning, but no one should start out on machines, nor should they be scared of starting.

Most "personal trainers" I saw knew nothing about basic, free weight lifts.

This is spot-on where I live. (Kerala, India)

The trainers have no experience with proper form coaching for the basic powerlifting exercises.

All the gyms here promote themselves as 'Bodybuilding gyms'.

All the members want to look like the muscle-bound moviestars from 'Bollywood' (presumably to get 'ze girls' :p)

I'm maybe 1 of 3 people in the whole gym clientele(all male) that even uses the Squat Rack. I'm on Stronglifts 5x5 for a month now and my lifts are definitely improving and so is my flexibility and core 'balance'.

Surprising side-effect: I don't feel 'clumsy' anymore.

And yeah, I get into long winded arguments with the 'trainers' twice a month, about why i don't use the cable machines for 'ze body'.

As an engineer at heart, I like to explain the idea to them something like: "You can pimp your cheap-ass car with all the bling you want, but when it counts, the German engine is going to make the difference. Besides, there's no harm in adding bling after you've got your own finely-tuned German engine under the hood"

Yes, its corny, but it got the message across and got the 'trainers' off my back.

I too am one of the only people in my gym who seems to care about building strength as opposed to trying to look like it.

As an anecdotal example: I finished five sets of farmer's walks with 105 pound (about 47 and a half kilograms) dumbbells in each hand. After I'd finished, I was approached by a bodybuilder type and told that I was wasting my time. What I really needed to do, he explained, was to do lunges in place, because what I was doing now wasn't "doing anything."

Apparently being able to pick up two hundred pounds of weight and walk around with it wasn't "doing anything."

Honestly, you're wasting your time getting into it with people like this. It's just a fundamentally different mindset. I just thank them politely for their advice (after all, they really do mean well, they just don't understand) and get on with my routine.

A bodybuilder-type once asked me what farmer's walks "works." Everything, I said.

Bodybuilders don't have much concept of conditioning, outside of being able to flex for long periods of time. Powerlifters care about raw strength, but for them, conditioning is being able to hit several very high lifts in the big three at a meet. It is a kind of conditioning, no question, but they're still going to gas pretty soon in any prolonged activity. Strongmen competitors, on the other hand, I think are phenomenal athletes who combine enormous strength with great conditioning.

Deadlifts, squats, and shoulder presses, done right, will fix your posterior chain and upper back. The trick is avoiding the ego-lift and only do as much as is safe and with proper form.

The bigger trick is having someone to show and critique your form.

(Gah, I miss lifting!)

Two things that weight training doesn't address is inward shoulder rotation/slumping and "turtle neck," something all people working at a keyboard are prone to. You really have to pay attention and make sure you pull your shoulders back, and keep your head and neck in alignment with the spine by pulling your head back and up (you might need to tilt it down, too).

Bench pressing can make the inward shoulders significantly worse by tightening the pectorals. I had a pretty bad problem and didn't realize it until I went to a posture specialist. Now I'm really aware of it - a lot of gym rats seem to have it.

Apparently squats and deadlifts will give you pretty extreme imbalances in the hip muscles (that's what the posture specialist and a deep-tissue masseur told me after working on me). You can fix that by stretching. I don't know if it matters, because it doesn't seem to affect me functionally or aesthetically.

> Two things that weight training doesn't address is inward shoulder rotation/slumping and "turtle neck," something all people working at a keyboard are prone to.

On the contrary, weight training will address exactly that, provided you balance pulling with pressing. Most "gym rats", as you say, seem to do nothing but bench press and curls. The bench press will, if not balanced by pulling, exaggerate the internal shoulder rotation.

Deadlifts, Rows, Pullups (or lat pulldowns if you must) -- all strengthen the back, and offset the shoulder rotation issues.

> Apparently squats and deadlifts will give you pretty extreme imbalances in the hip muscles (that's what the posture specialist and a deep-tissue masseur told me after working on me). You can fix that by stretching. I don't know if it matters, because it doesn't seem to affect me functionally or aesthetically.

This is also not true. Many gym trainees who actually attempt to squat will do it with a very narrow stance, and a very shallow depth. This makes it a quad dominant exercise, which could be a problem if they didn't also deadlift. However, a full depth back squat is a very balanced exercise, and will do wonders to increase hip mobility, not to mention strength. Deadlifts are the single best exercise for strengthening the posterior chain, which anyone who picks something heavy up off the ground needs.

Many people avoid squatting and deadlifting because they think they will hurt themselves, so they end up doing much worse things: leg press, smith machine squats, hack squats. Instead, learn the lifts properly ("Starting Strength" by Mark Rippetoe is a fabulous book for this), and you will realize how valuable they are.

"Deadlifts, Rows, Pullups (or lat pulldowns if you must) -- all strengthen the back, and offset the shoulder rotation issues."

They don't because the pulling muscles don't have full range of motion. Your lats pull your arms but not your shoulders, and your traps pull your shoulders up. The muscles pulling your shoulder blades together never get enough work to start tightening and offsetting the pull from the tightening pecs.

Deadlifts are great for most spinal erectors, but don't do enough for your neck to get proper alignment if you sit in front of the computer all day.

"However, a full depth back squat is a very balanced exercise, and will do wonders to increase hip mobility, not to mention strength."

Not really. I've never seen anyone with a fully balanced squat. Either the quads or (usually) the hamstrings will dominate. Squats will probably increase hip mobility for someone who has poor hip mobility and hasn't squatted before, but they're also a quick way to get hip flexor and posterior chain tightness if you don't offset it with stretching.

> Two things that weight training doesn't address is inward shoulder rotation/slumping and "turtle neck," something all people working at a keyboard are prone to. You really have to pay attention and make sure you pull your shoulders back, and keep your head and neck in alignment with the spine by pulling your head back and up (you might need to tilt it down, too).

I'll watch out, thanks! Though I feel that with power cleans, pull-ups/chin-ups, and a standing desk at work, those problems might not hit me as hard.

> Bench pressing can make the inward shoulders significantly worse by tightening the pectorals. I had a pretty bad problem and didn't realize it until I went to a posture specialist. Now I'm really aware of it - a lot of gym rats seem to have it.

At least alternate your bench presses with overhead presses. And do something for your shoulders.

> Apparently squats and deadlifts will give you pretty extreme imbalances in the hip muscles (that's what the posture specialist and a deep-tissue masseur told me after working on me). You can fix that by stretching. I don't know if it matters, because it doesn't seem to affect me functionally or aesthetically.

Is this true for below parallel squats, too? And what kind of stretching?

There's no way to compensate for tightening pectorals by weightlifting because the antagonist muscles have no range of motion - the best you can do is push your shoulder blades together. That's why you have to stretch your pecs and consciously work to pull your shoulders back when you're standing. The standing desk is probably a really good idea for preventing "turtle neck," because as far as I know there's no weight exercise where you push your head back and stretch the neck out (again, this is something that I do consciously now when walking).

Lower-body imbalances from squats will depend on how wide your stance is, where you point your knees, and how you use your muscles. Generally narrow and pointing forward you'll use quads, wider and out and it's glutes or hamstrings. I was definitely a hamstrings-dominant squatter and as a result I have tight hip flexors and hamstrings (this is apparently pretty common).

Thanks for the information about the tightening pectorals. Now I know what you mean. I sometimes see this postural problem at the gym with people who are in love with bench presses.

> The standing desk is probably a really good idea for preventing "turtle neck," because as far as I know there's no weight exercise where you push your head back and stretch the neck out (again, this is something that I do consciously now when walking).

Actually, that sounds like what I am doing at the end of a deadlift. Pull-ups and power cleans may also contribute.

But I'll watch out anyway.

I'll look up the muscles used on the squat. I am not that familiar with the anatomical names---in German we tended to use the vernacular.

If you are a beginner and gym unfriendly, I have found that strength training sites oriented towards women spend a lot more time talking about proper form (because they know many women won't just turn up to a gym - they want to train in private to start with).

Eg:

http://www.stumptuous.com/worship-at-the-altar-of-the-goddes...

Start with little or no weight. I started my squat with the bar and 2x25 pound weights. I've reached 4x45 pound weights + the bar after about a year. I took it slow and steady because I did not want to injure myself. I actually had someone compliment my squat form the other day! Thats a great feeling knowing where you started. Like anything, you just need to devote effort to getting better.

Similar for me. I started with just the bar (20kg) in April, and am now at 120kg (i.e. bar plus two 45 pound weights and one 12.5 pound weight on each side).

Just make sure you log everything, and keep pushing yourself, but with good form. Squat to (slightly below) parallel.

I agree on the proper form. But free weight are on of the best ways to fix your posterior chain and upper back.

Pull-ups, press-ups, running and jumping also work wonders for beginners, and it's even harder to get those dangerously wrong. (That is, as long as you don't wear shoes while running. Shoes will make good running form much harder.)

Just start slowly, log everything, and build your way up.

Don't waste your time, and your form on the gym-machines.

>The simple truth is that any (non-crackpot) regimented training program will significantly improve a geek's fitness.

Taking a daily walk outside is a good start. By doing so you shift your attention into a different environment and into moving the body. This somehow recharges the mental batteries, which in turn improves one's physical health.

One tweak can significantly increase the benefit at little extra cost. During the walk, take one short sprint (long enough to lose your breath slightly; it'll probably take less than a minute).

I can't explain why this helps but it does seem to help me. Something to do with keeping aerobic capacity in trim?

I cannot second this enough. When I was just starting exercising I was overthinking things and it was a waste of time. The important thing at the beginning was just to start doing something.

Once I started hitting plateaus then I started reading again and tweaking my routine to help get past them, but that was after several months working hard to develop a solid base.

Now, after being in grad school for a couple of years while working full time and raising kids, I lost a lot and I need to start working on my baseline again, but that is another story.

"Fitness" is kind of a vague term. What are your exact goals in regards to "fitness?" Are you training for endurance? Strength? Explosive power? Or are you training for a specific sport?

The "minute details" are anything but if you've got a specific goal in mind other than just "fitness."

Totally agree. People look always for the blue pill.

Highly detailed training and nutrition plans are for advanced athletes.