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Comment by notspanishflu | Hacker News Reader

The sovereignty of Spain falls on all Spanish citizens.

If you allow a referendum on such topic in a part of Spain, it doesn't matter the result because you're accepting implicitly that a part of Spain can rule over the whole.

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Let me play whataboutism. Cannot we say that in this case the independence of Kosovo should be decided by all citizens of Serbia (who are against it)? And independence of ex-soviet satellite countries should be decided by all citizens of ex-USSR which means they have to return back to Mother Russia?

The sovereignty of Spain falls on all Spanish citizens. The sovereignty of Catalonia falls on theirs (if they wish so).

One way to look at it is that the sovereign country of Spain has a right to split itself up in two countries. Therefore all Spaniards should have a say.

Another way to look at it is that every sub-entity of any country has a right to unilaterally declare itself independent for whatever reason (often because it is wealthier).

I think neither of these views is sufficient. We have to accept that this is a tricky question that is very difficult to solve in a principled way.

How about the third way, where a region is increasingly unhappy with the central government (look at the election results in the past 20 years), and wants to have a legal option of getting out of the union if/when they start feeling opressed.

People have been talking about this for decades and nothing has been done.

How do you think people in Galicia and Basque Country are feeling now? Is this what should make them proud of being Spanish?

Also many people are tired of the monarchy.

Where do you draw the line so that not every wealthy region or city unhappy with its net tax payer status secedes from poorer parts of the country?

You say that the Catalonian people feel oppressed. By what standard is that actually the case though? As far as I know, Catalonia enjoys very far reaching autonomy within Spain.

Why? I don't follow your idea. Could you explain?

Yes, it's hard to follow the logic. But still a lot of people seem to think that all Spain should vote on a referendum on whether Catalonia should be independent. Go figure.

What part you don't understand?

I'll try again.

All Spaniards have voice & vote about sovereignty, not just a bunch of Spaniards.

That is not clearer, at least to me.

>All Spaniards have voice & vote about sovereignty, not just a bunch of Spaniards.

This seems self-contradictory. Mis-typed? Or perhaps you mean it's up to all Spaniards, not just some Spaniards?

All Spaniards have the right, not only a part of Spaniards (like those living in Catalonia).

You're advocating making the people in Catalonia prisoners to the rest of Spain.

It's like saying that the Welsh should have a right to vote on the independence of Scotland.

They're saying, I think, that if you're going to have a referendum on independence, ever citizen of the existing state should vote, not just members of the proposed state. Otherwise, you could just have thousands of tiny groups of people each declaring their own independent state.

As a UK citizen, I would have preferred it if our recent referendum had been voted on by all members of the EU, rather than just British citizens.

I know you're not supposed to comment about downvotes, but seriously people? I literally asked for clarification and got -3 for it. Easy on the downvote button, people.

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