wrldos

That's how they presented their argument. It can be presented both ways depending on how you want to promote it.

Yes you're right. Unfortunately while using things for like I keep standing in the poop on the shed carpet.

yes I use it on macOS as well. I'm writing this on my Mac.

I am an active independent user group member. This isn't just about startups and big tech who are actually fairly low on seat counts. There are huge numbers lots of us corporate dystopias using this stack. On Windows. And you'll have never heard of any of us.

I wish Twitter was publicly traded right now. I need some excitement in my life.

Google or Russ Cox's reputation is irrelevant. The idea stands alone. I'm merely crediting him with the idea.

I read the proposal. There is no discussion of the legality of this at all. I'd expect anyone with any level of supposed technical competence to consider this in relation to global data protection. I suspect there has been no legal review as mentioned in the thread because I know how slow the lawyers in this space work and the timeline between publishing this and now is too short to have had a conclusive answer.

As for your point about GDPR, I think if you apply your right to withdraw from opt out data collection and what that entails and then ask how this glaring defect is missing from RSC's paper, then you'll see exactly how much privacy consideration really went into this.

They still are good products. If you stick your fingers in you ears and forget about the bad bits. It's like living in a garden shed which has been painted nicely inside. You can live a happy existence with a bit of ignorance.

So I'm miserable.

This place can be quite bipolar. I actually quit HN for a long period over the "second coming of Microsoft" when the entire HN crowd was crowing of Satya's ascent into grand hegemon position because the sycophantry was making me wretch. My comments about the same old Microsoft were downvoted to oblivion and any dissident voices squashed. The US tech community spoke and would not listen to warnings.

And here we are, back at ground zero.

Um, every .Net Core developer I know, which is quite a few at multiple companies, are still doing everything on Windows and Visual Studio classic. Windows is still a massive concern for the tech community and most of those people seem to absolutely dislike windows 11 to the point they're all using Macs at home. Even our windows-centric SQL Server DBAs have macs at home.

No one is going to buy corporate Macs though because Windows and Office is the best corporate dystopia for the compliance check boxers.

Ah Rust. I've written a few thousand lines. Nothing major. It feels like it's got the same personality as C++. You know a shit hot weapon that fires the world's most powerful missiles but at the same time makes embarrassing fart noises. I mean it's really good but I spend a lot of time defending the fart noises rather than firing the missiles.

No it's not up for debate at all. Much like when Microsoft did this with .Net core, the Github thread is clearly a misguided post by RSC expecting the community to conform or support it. They didn't so now it's a damage control exercise. It will happen.

Any corporate controlled project on this scale is prone to this failure mode.

I think you're right on the mark there. I'm jaded and cynical enough to know what's going to hurt me and what's going to pay the bills and that's where my interest stops. 20 years of C# and 35 years of Unix now :(

Worshipping any vendor is quite frankly a bit sad.

I tend to avoid having to solve problems now. If I do it tends to go somewhere vendor neutral like python on whatever platform happens to be lying around and not annoying me at the time.

But is that not the decision of the person who owns the data?

But that's wrong. There is no position for this in a civilised society:

"If we ask everyone is going to say no, so we will steal it unless someone tells us not to"

This is an incorrect assertion.

We have to ask for permission on our SaaS products to collect this data as it's not necessary to collect it for the product to function. The EU GDPR mandates this.

Russ Cox is suggesting that there is no permission step and that the data is collected by default.

That is the issue.

Imagine if GNU started adding telemetry to their compiler toolchain...

If that sounds fucking stupid, which it does, then so does this.

Yes I agree there. They seem to be a PR and marketing company these days with the odd reskin here and there.

It’s not that here. I use iOS because I don’t want anyone embedding several bloated half baked ancient hole ridden security nightmare browser engines in their apps which do everything possible to bypass system wide network restrictions so they can carry out whatever bad behaviour their business model thinks is acceptable. I want one system wide browser that respects the security configuration at OS level.

I want this for myself and the surface area of our 500 or so staff.

This I can agree with. I was hoping that Apple was going to actually succeed in doing this with iOS but it looks like regulatory bodies are ganging up on them and their motivations weren't entirely honest. They are possibly the least shit vendor still though, not the best. If only they had a decent plugin model for ad blocking.

I await the inevitable bloated 3rd party apps which literally just embed their own browsers to circumvent the device level control we actually had for a bit there over the network layer...

I can't honestly even consider reading this from the vendor in question. I appreciate Firefox and use it on a regular basis but no browser, OS vendor or standard agency out there has an ounce of respect left from me.

Nothing any OS vendor or browser vendor has done in the last decade has been a user-focused positive experience. They have become delivery tools for revenue only rather than information access. Even Firefox which is turning up now with crapware splash screens turned on by default.

Until that changes, I'm deaf to any position.

Yeah I know a couple of pilots, one of whom does "flying scum buses" as he calls them to hot places around Europe and have a lot of horror stories. Nothing major: bits of planes falling off, people going bananas, near misses etc.

I generally don't fly these days and haven't actually been in a plane for 20 years (ex wife couldn't fly due to med issue) but I need to get out there and would like to pick the least shitty solution.

I'd rather have a safe bad experience than a shiny plane crash.

Reading the thread under that suggests I will be starting an airline shitlist effective immediately.

Some localities they are useful and some they get in the way. Emergency ham operation is not always required or welcome. It’s very specific to certain localities.

Then they go and immediately go and shaft you with a set of non-opt-outable welcome emails with Windows 11. I think any credit due can be shoved up their ass.

They're really not. I have two guys unfucking a yarn and NPM shit show at the moment.

Ah yeah I totally lost it in 2019. Difficult to describe what happened but I just stopped functioning completely for about 6 months. I managed to hide it from everyone successfully which I don’t recommend. Fortunately something went click just as covid kicked off and I managed to sort it out. I’d go as far as saying that covid might have actually saved me because it brought most people down to where I was so it was easier to evaluate myself.

I guarantee we will not be upselling AWS egress fees to you though so think of the cost savings on recovery!

Our customers can't operate at all if our systems are down, so yes we do.

Ah I am gorging myself financially on exactly that form of sweet misery.

I've never seen a dev stack in docker actually work. What I see is the poor new guy spending several hours trying to get docker working and configuring private repositories that don't work, then nothing works when they finally get it up which results in the dude spending at least 2 more days trying to reverse engineer the shit show or consult little pockets of knowledge hiding in out of date confluence documents and other people's heads who are on holiday.