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>You don’t understand what you’re talking about

So you look at the graph I linked that shows the Xeon model is faster than the consumer I9 chip. And your brain says "the Xeon is slower." Then tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

Tell me, do you ever stand in a lake and tell people you're dry? Are you in the lake to hide the pee? Do you tell people about the wonders of horse dewormer?

See, the only way your argument works is to compare the M1 to the I9. And despite the Xeon being faster than the I9, as literally and plainly shown in the tests I linked, you keep saying it's slower. ... But then you keep saying they're the same. Reality: it's faster, literally look at the numbers. Your mental gymnastics are amazing. I am not hostile. I have been getting great laughs and relaxation out of you. Yes, that comes at your expense.

> person who tried to explain it to you

By saying wet is dry. I get your explanation. I just see what my eyes tell me. You see blue, your brain says "nah, it's orange."

I'm also not sure why you're sarcastic about ECC RAM. I have 128GB of RAM in my laptop. If it wasn't ECC, I'd have crashes in my VMs and errors in my calculations. When you go 32GB+ and actually use the RAM, anything that doesn't support ECC cannot be taken seriously for professional use. Like the M1 Max.

Xeon W-11955M (8 cores)

It's only a little thicker than the macbook pro. It's keyboard doesn't break, and the product line has had a 4k screen since 5 years ago. It's 120Hz refresh rate. It has a very large power brick - 240W, it gets hot and loud with a huge fan exhaust. It's thick metal and about 7-9lb - you can run over it with a car. It only gets 9 hours battery w/ regular usage, and about 3 hours of "fan on time." Keep in mind, with the large and loud fan on, it can stay at 5GHz. This is called a pro laptop - a workstation. When I travel, I bring a 65W PSU, and it runs fine on that, just w/o turbo boost.

No, don't point to the lower "geekbench" score for this laptop - that's not a CPU test. GPU performance is a large part of that test, and they run the test on the default GPU. The M1 only has a single GPU. The Precision's default is the low power integrated graphics, not the discreet GPU. If you have a test where they assign the discreet GPU, please feel free to point it out.

As I've discussed before here, I have a shell script that runs in parallel with a bunch of VMs. My coworkers air (yes, I know it's not the max) runs it in 8-10 hours overnight. I run it over lunch. It loads, does calculations on, and creates graphs from several gig of ascii performance data.

What does compare in performance to the M1 air is my Latitude w/ the I7 in it. The M1 "max" is "max for apple" but competes with mid-tier laptops from everyone else. And that's ignoring the fact that it can't run pretty much any of the useful industry tools or games w/o recompiling x86 to arm on the fly.

Yes, I think my Dell cost the company $7-8k, without support. That's why it's called a pro laptop.

A Big Little Park https://www.biglittle.fr/

A Little Big Song: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mDFBTdToRmw

Now as far as big little countries, this one seems to have a population (non-resident) of 2k. This is huge for a micronation, although by definition of the word, it seems Hong Kong would be the largest micronation. This is because size does not define the term - only that the residents claim they're a country and most other countries don't recognize them as one. Other notable micronation is of course the famous Sealand, hosting the world's child porn from an abandoned oil platform.

Trains when I went back to Russia for a couple of years as an adult: mix of soviet and modern cars. In the soviet ones, the bedding is still from those soviet times. It's itchy, you're not sure whether it's clean, it smells a little funny. The toilets are disgusting, and you want to wash your hands and face from a water bottle -just trust me on that. You got some bunk mates in the 4-bed room. They're annoying, they're idiots, and they pretend to drink tea in class, while mostly just drinking cheap vodka. They step out by the car entrance to smoke every ten minutes, but reak of booze, BO, and smoke - so the whole car reaks too.

The new cars are clean, double the price, nice toilets, everything is plastic, everything smells like plastic. It feels like you're on an airplane. There's no magic.

Spent about a month in Kazakhstan, but flew in there from Moscow. Honestly - egh. Nothing special, just a smaller city with fairly friendly people trying to get through the day.

His common issue is he expected to invest time to make money. You need to invest money to make money. This is why I sometimes laugh at a guy who can't get a good job, has no savings, is borrowing cash from friends to pay the rent and maxing out credit cards for food. Sometimes that guy's solution to being poor is "I'm going to start my own business." When you build on a foundation of nothing, your house collapses.

He ran an ad campaign - it clearly worked. He needed to run it more, and bigger, and yes, eat the cost of it from personal savings. In a business, you first spend money, then you make money. There are no freebies just because you have an idea. Stories of that happening are like self-learning guitar because you plan on being a rockstar.

The reason people don't want to pay for a new project from a new person? Because there's high risk of it being dead within a year - like all of this guy's projects. It's the same reason I don't start watching any new shows till they've had a few seasons out. Don't want to invest hours into the plot just to have it cancelled and left w/o closure in after two seasons.

It's also a reason no one joined things like google plus or used any of their other now dead projects. They proudly declare they try many things to see what sticks and kill the rest. Well, I'm not willing to give my time for free to their unpaid focus group.

So what he needed to do was save up, spend those savings on letting people know about his product, take the risk of loosing that cash, and give the product away at first. Then when the paid product comes, there is a huge user base he paid for, and people see the risk of it being killed as minimized.

Law is not just for right and wrong. Most laws and regulations are to further people's interests, like the google people submitting the documents. This is called freedom of speech. Legislators are free to not read them.

> excert economic pressure on lawmakers

I don't think this means what you think it means. To exert economic pressure on a lawmaker (a person) means to make them to personally lose money in some way. This is a pretty grave accusation - it means "if you don't agree with us, we are going to damage you financially. Google has not being caught attacking people financially, or threatening them, or even paying off lawmakers thus far.

Google is also allowed to place their products in their own systems by default (not android, which is open source). If you buy a Samsung phone, Samsung picks the defaults - some are google, some are Samsung, some may be the carrier you bought the phone from. Of course if google makes the Pixel, it's going to have google's defaults. Are you surprised when you buy an LG TV, LG also makes the remote, despite plenty of other brands of remotes available for that TV and others?

As far as buying themselves default search placement within other products? Have you been to the grocery store? Did you know every brand you see there pays for better shelf space and placement?

There is literally zero wrong with any of what is going on here. Plenty of bad things about google. This ain't one of them. This is them purposely damaging their product for some of the possible market. Which is their choice. They are not "gimping the web" - they are simply making their own products worse. If google's search wasn't a good default choice in a firefox (it is), firefox would take google's payoff, decline in use and lose marketshare, and in lose turn google's money since they don't have market share anymore. And firefox is free to do that.

This is equivalent quite simply to someone putting out an inferior product - for example a phone that needs to scan a government issue photo id, so the phone maker - not your carrier - can identify you. There are people who don't care, and they are the target market. There are people who laugh at it and just buy something else. They are not the target market.

They did not try to change the web into anything. They tried and to some extent did change their browser into an inferior product, and change their ad network into an inferior product. Websites placing ads and ad exchanges are free to not use google's products. Web users are free not to use their product like their browser. I use google translate - that's about it. Not even maps, since heremaps is and always was simply superior.

They also tried to change regulations to suit them better. But they are allowed. Trying to change here simply means making their opinion known to the people who make the rules. They didn't bribe anyone. They emailed pdf files describing their ridiculous point of view.

The takeaway is they are a corporation with inferior products, who will do what's legal to make more money. Most people don't care. Some people are free to choose other products.

Azure and AWS for example completely destroy GCP This is because google treats the people who do care about google's inferior points, like they're a phone user who doesn't care if they're tracked. So google can't get any marketshare there for their inferior products. Despite GCP from a purely technical aspect being superior. When packaged with the worst customer service available, and the risk of losing all your data and backups permanently w/o notification, because you mistakenly hire a guy who is known to google as a hacker? They're not even a player for any customer that plans to be successful long-term.

It's a choice, pick what you want to do and who you want to do. Google is not hiding who they are. Or doing anything wrong. They just make inferior products. But VHS won the format battle.

It's not clickbait, because the article literally tells you both the positives and negatives, as well as titling it "mixed bag" instead of "apple loses." We call this a balanced review.

But I get it. Anything that's not "m1 is revolutionary" is clickbait to the apple crowd.

This is the big takeaway. All of Apple's comparisons are to their own previous hardware, which was about a year behind the competition. In addition, if you look at Geekbench scores of the M1 Max, those include a lot of tests that use the GPU. When the tests are run against the competition, they are artificially lowered by running the test on the default low power integrated graphics, instead of specifying the discreet GPU.

In reality, the M1 is not a pro laptop as the industry defines "pro." It is only a pro laptop compared to Apple's other offerings, and competes with mid-tier laptops from everyone else.

Have you noticed almost no one uses ARM? There's a reason for that. Including software being licensed per core, so faster hotter cores and fewer of them win.

I run about 50k worth of software licenses on the laptop and generate millions in revenue per quarter with it. That's why it's a pro laptop, and I'm sure my company paid about double your number after you add in dell's pro support plus. Pro laptop for pro work. You're a kid who wants toys, but wants to say you're using professional equipment. I got something that's like the pro mac laptop. work gave that to me too for secondary tasks. it's called a dell latitude. it runs the latest i7 and no ecc memory. great for chromecasting porn and playing games in the browser, 13 hours of battery unlike the precision's 9, and much lighter. they just don't call it a pro.

In summary, you are full of crap if you think an untuned blind geekbench score is what you're going by - an aggregation of a whole bunch of tests, using defaults. My statement is true, as I kick off the same data processing script on my laptop and it finishes it over lunch, while my coworker kicks it off overnight.

> Xeon with a greater TDP than 45w

yes, the Xeon W-11955M in the Dell is 45W. Now add the RTX GPU - which coincidentally will be doing most of the work. Unless you're running the geekbench test you're referring to, to purposely gimp the results. That Intel integrated graphics chip uses almost no power.

go process a large dataset and do some calculations on it. Run a bunch of VMs while you're doing it to - let's say 3. Give each one 32G of memory. Better be ECC memory too, or your data won't be reliable. Maybe in about 5 years when apple catches up to the current pro laptops, you'll be able to. This is why all the m1 comparisons they do is to previous generation intel chips in their old laptops. which have always been slow. apple has always used outdated hardware, in everything they've ever made.

>Apple doesn't need to have the one fastest laptop out there

correct. My complaint, which I have reiterated about 50 times to shiny iphone idiots on here who don't do any real number crunching for work, is when the industry calls "mid tier" something that apple calls "pro" - apple is deceiving the consumer with marketing. The new laptops are a competition to Dell's Latitude and XPS lines. Not their pro lines. Those pro laptops weigh 7lb, and have a huge, loud fan exhaust on the back so they can clock at 5GHz for an hour. They have 128GB of RAM - ECC RAM, because if you have that much RAM w/o ECC, you have a high chance of bit errors.

There are many things you can do to speed up your stuff, if you waste electricity. The issue is not that apple doesn't make a good laptop. It's that they're lying to the consumer. As always. Do you remember when they marketed their acrylic little cube mini-desktop? It was "a supercomputer." They do this as a permanent tactic - sell overpriced underperforming things, and lie with marketing. Like using industry standard terms to describe things not up to that standard.

https://www.servethehome.com/dell-precision-7540-with-intel-...

in fact, i'm not sure you can even order a xeon precision w/o ecc ram. but i'm not here to do your research for you for things you can look up in a minute. you're the one that claimed a xeon precision doesn't come w/ ecc ram, without even googling it.

my laptop is a 7660. I also have an i7 5560, and a latitude 7410 w/ an I7. It's what work gives me for work - and yes, I use all 3 since we went full remote. For "pro" work. The M1 laptop is comparable to my 7410 - which I use to play online games and chromecast videos. Not any real work. It's a kids toy compared to my 7660.

since you seem to be lost here on this tech site, instead of hanging out on reddit with your peers: all xeon CPUs support ECC ram. If you want you can go on ebay, buy ECC ram, and put it in any Xeon system. Or, you know, just order it w/ ECC ram from Dell.

>It is common for Dell Precisions to ship with Xeons and not ECC ram.

correct. because most come with 16 or 32GB or RAM, and are the low end of Dell's pro line. Once you get a lot of RAM, like 64 or 128GB, and you're crunching numbers and running VMs, your chances of a memory error go up dramatically. Which is why you need ECC RAM. Which has zero to do with your post that I was replying to, claiming precisions don't have ecc ram. now find me an m1 laptop with 128GB of ECC RAM. Because you're right - "Enough" strawman astroturfing from you.

The M1 is a Latitude competitor - not a Precision competitor. Apple's "pro" line is considered mid-tier from other vendors. Their tests showing it beats xeons are comparing xeons released 2 years ago, that for some reason they used in their apple laptops. Because Apple has always used outdated CPUs compared to everyone else.

You're literally here saying the M1 is going to replace a server chip. Newsflash - the M1 doesn't even run any of the needed code, because it's arm code - a small niche.

which is the top of their salary ceiling, and it's not a high number, like at all. the top number for software devs is about 700k. In my field, people make 200k+. But we're not talking about "pro" people. We're talking about a "pro" laptop. It's the best thing that apple makes - that doesn't make it "pro." It's got the performance of the midrange systems from everyone else.

>I think software engineers don’t need fast laptops either. yeah, when I run a script to read a few gig of performance data and do a bunch of calculations on it, I need a fast laptop. Until that's done, I'm sitting there, CPU maxed out, not able to do anything else. With an M1, I have to arrange my schedule to process the dataset overnight. With a Dell I run it over lunch. Case closed.

>We need mainframes and fast local networks. Nothing beats compiling at the speed of 192 cores at once.

I'm not a software engineer anymore. When I was, no, I did not usually compile on the server. I compiled on my workstation. Because you're not on a fast local network. You're at an airport for 4 hours, or on a plane for 5 hours, or on a comcast connection at your house.

But here I am, with a pretty thin and very durable laptop that has a 6 core Xeon in it. It gets hot, it has huge fans, and it completely obliterates any M1 laptop. I don't mean it's twice as fast. I mean things run at 5x or faster vs an M1.

Now, this is a new version of the M1, but it's an incremental 1-year improvement. It'll be very slightly faster than the old gen. By ditching Intel, what apple did is making sure their pro line - which is about power, not mobility, is no longer a competitor, and never will be. Because when you want a super fast chip, you don't design up from a freaking cell phone CPU. You design down from a server CPU. You know, to get actual work done, professionally. But yeah, I do see their pro battery is 11 hours while mine usually dies at 9. Interesting how I got my computer plugged in most of the time though...

backported 4.2, which includes some of the 4.3 changes as well. supports lineage. 4.1 is a version google supports till 2024, so I'm assuming 4.2/4.3 is going to be even later. So, you got a phone from 2011 that's going to run a modern kernel and latest android till after 2024.

> And to illustrate what I mean by ancient

yes. I would love to see an iphone from 2011 that's going to be running the latest ios and apple kernel after 2024.