1,334 karma · joined September 15, 2023
echo '0.0.0.0 news.ycombinator.com' >> /etc/hosts
Let's go back to the poster's super weird assertion. By definition, a provocation is something which results in a response. Observing that it is a provocation isn't the same as endorsing the response. Knee jerk categorization doesn't remove this discernment. Instead it misleads by glossing over the details. I would regard that to be a byproduct of propaganda.
Professor John Mearsheimer of the realist school has some hour long lectures on the topic of Ukraine. Some even precede the war itself. Obviously as a disclaimer, I do not agree with everything he has to say. You can pick and choose which sources or interviewers better appeal to your partisan biases. I won't choose for you, as you might dismiss it based on the source. That said, he's spoken with everyone from Amy Goodman on "Democracy Now!" to the Hoover Institution.
You might consider how your framing of super weird Russian propaganda applies to his lectures and interviews.
>...state the origin of the conflict as if a sovereign people being invaded deserved it.
I've done noting of the sort. The origins of the conflict are more complex than your framing allows. Furthermore, as we attempt to describe those origins, it would be helpful if you didn't confuse that description of events with a prescription or endorsement of specific actors.
If we are unable to describe something coherently, we are unable to reason or have a reasonable discussion around it. Reasonable people should be able to hold distinct concepts in their mind simultaneously, even if they are seemingly contradictory from a surface level. As an example, we can and should be able to describe the events, speculate as to the underlying incentives of various parties and simultaneously hold moral principles which reject the use of violence.
Propaganda can sometimes mislead by conflating these things. This prevents reasonable discussion.
I regard it as important context. Yes, the country seems to be devolving into partisan recrimination. Similarly the comments...
However, there was a time when obvious crimes like torture and false pretenses for war were excused in the name of decorum. Whether Comey is guilty or not, whether the Russia Hoax was criminal or not, it is easy to see how the proceedings are becoming untenable.
But then, was a system that excused torture and false pretenses for war on a sound footing to begin with? Something is rotten on the Potomac.
The narrow partisan takes supporting or reacting with outrage to their opponent's weaponization of the judicial system seem irrelevant in comparison. There's a larger picture worth looking at if we can expand beyond the narrow view.
https://ccrjustice.org/ccrs-assessment-obama-administrations...
>Despite the fact that the prosecution of officials responsible for serious human rights abuses is required under both domestic and international law, President Obama has repeatedly indicated his reluctance to pursue prosecutions for these crimes, saying that he prefers to look forward rather than backward.
>In August, the Obama administration announced new transfer policy recommendations that endorse the continued practice of rendition: the forced transfer of a person to another country to be detained, interrogated and possibly tortured.
This keeps coming up on this site. It seems like a basic premise for a nuanced and compassionate worldview. Humility is required. Even if we assume the best intentions, the fallible nature of man places limits on what we can do.
Yet we keep seeing posters appealing to Scientism and "objective truth". I'm not sure it is possible to have a reasonable discussion where basic premises diverge. It is clear how these themes have been used in history to support some of the worst atrocities.
Meanwhile the other partisans are insisting that the paracetamol claim is junk science. The whole episode is ridiculous. I get the sense that if RFK linked lung cancer to smoking, the same appeals to tradition would be used by the opposition.
I remember hearing the claim that paracetamol wouldn't be approved under current standards decades ago. Wasn't sure about that, but I generally avoid tablets of all kinds. It wasn't especially relevant for me then or now.
https://www.fda.gov/media/188843/download?attachment
>Notice to Physicians on the Use of Acetaminophen During Pregnancy
> The association is an ongoing area of scientific debate and clinicians should be aware of the issue in their clinical decision-making, especially given that most short-term fevers in pregnant women and young children do not require medication.
>In the spirit of patient safety and prudent medicine, clinicians should consider minimizing the use of acetaminophen during pregnancy for routine low-grade fevers. This consideration should also be balanced with the fact that acetaminophen is the safest over-the-counter alternative in pregnancy among all analgesics and antipyretics; aspirin and ibuprofen have well-documented adverse impacts on the fetus
*As a redundant disclaimer for HN, that belief would put me in opposition to Trump's policies.
However when describing the outcome all things are not equal. We shouldn't fall into the trap of an appeal to utopia.
Selling into the US presents advantages on economies of scale. Overseas dollar denominated debt drives dollar demand. These factors affect decisions for producers selling into the US market.
The specific pricing data is subject to cherry picking and politicalization. Generally it is a bit strange to see the illiberal left taking exception with Trump's illiberal interventionism. You get the sense that if the interventions were rationalized by a different actor or for a different reason, the statistics would be spun in the other direction. This feels inconsistent and hypocritical.
The other key point is that the tariff doom prophesies haven't yet come to pass. Perhaps the doomsaying was merely more political bloviation? It would fit with the pattern of inconsistency.
>I read hackernews on a daily basis and I visit lots of different websites regularly. I am almost always on my VPN as I am internally firewalled by the government and externally shooed because of the sanctions, so I am probably missing some of these heart-warming messages:
>>Iranian IPs are blocked here, due to your decision to arm Russia with drones so that they can indiscriminately massacre civilians.
> I actually do not blame the people who do this. I think there is a fundamental misconception that people think because "Islamic Republic" has the word "Republic" in it, it must be a government of people in charge.
Total war and total information war are the side effects of the Democracy meme. Everyone from a taxi driver to a professor is assumed to be a political actor. The rationale runs something like this, "because you have a vote, you are defacto responsible for the actions of your state and political classes. Vote harder next time."
Meanwhile the individuals involved never explicitly consented to be governed. Even if there were a meaningful democratic process, it doesn't follow that the individual could withdraw consent. Ironically one of the suggested avenues for withdrawing consent in a democracy is to refuse to vote.
https://world.kbs.co.kr/service/news_view.htm?Seq_Code=18451...
I don't generally favor Trump's policies or the opposition's. Yet it is impossible to have a discussion here without providing explicit disclaimers. Even with those disclaimers, we're constantly brigaded with red-herrings, non-sequiturs and ridiculous claims tilting at what is incorrectly perceived as Trump support.
It is difficult to even criticize Trump's policies, unless the criticism is one of the curated forms prescribed by the outrage-o-sphere.
Access to the US market has other values. If the manufacturer is carrying USD denominated debt, they or someone else must obtain those dollars through trade. Access to a large market may unlock economies of scale for producers. Losing access may drive up their overall costs to serve other markets.
These are just two of the most obvious things which I can immediately think of. There are likely other factors as well.
>U.S. authorities said some of the detained Korean workers had illegally crossed the U.S. border, while others entered legally but had expired visas or entered on visa waivers that prohibited them from working.
From PBS, a source with a well known editorial stance against the current administration.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/south-korean-workers-retu...
>Like many of the Koreans who were working there, advocates and lawyers representing the non-Korean workers caught up in the raid say that some who were detained had legal authorization to work in the United States.
LA Times, similar
https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2025-09-14/famili...
With any of these contentious partisan issues it is important to be wary of cherry picking. Typically events are selectively reported to fit a given partisan agenda.
It would be extreme to believe that entire groups are being arbitrarily detained and deported. Similarly, it isn't unreasonable to expect mistakes to be made. The reasonable thing to do with extreme claims such as the ones made in this thread is to do a simple Google search before engaging in partisan flames. It has become almost impossible to have a reasonable discussion here on any topic which may tangentially involve Trump.
Here's an even handed approach and overview of some of the tariff related stats. The presenter is a critic of tariffs, but concedes that the results thus far are not as simple as some here would suggest.
6:22
> This is just a matter of acknowledging the data on the graph and saying this is quite a difference from the way it was a year ago. And so, people who said this wouldn't happen, that's wrong. It did happen. There it is. And I think it's important to acknowledge that. Um, not only that, but a lot of people said, "Well, this is going to lead to the price of goods, especially automobiles, coming into the United States, is going to skyrocket." Well, so far that hasn't been the case.
>In fact, prices have come down. And you can go to Google and you can look it up and there's many articles discussing the fact that the Chinese automakers have largely been eating the tariffs so far.
The questions are:
Is it is more or less destructive than the alternative destruction? Who is it more economically destructive for? Over what time period is it more or less destructive than the alternative interventionism? Is 6 months a meaningful time horizon?
It becomes muddled very quickly. I would appeal for a consistent approach which opposes both forms of destructive interventionism.
A more coherent critique might lay out the shortcomings of both flavors of economic interventionism. Instead, we're stuck in a partisan debate over who has a better central planning approach. Maybe there are reasonable or pragmatic points to be made there, but admitting as much allows the possibility that perhaps Trump's interventions should be measured empirically, rather than rejected based on the a priori flaws of interventionism.
Partisans are free to pick and choose which statistics and time periods they feel best illustrate their case. Easy to see how this devolves into incoherence.
Specifically when you say:
>Globalism fixes the amount of pollution globally to the market optimum where presumably an environmentalist wants to control pollution using some other system than markets.
We can observe that the Globalist organizations regard not just pollution, but carbon consumption to be something which markets cannot be trusted to manage. Instead they propose top-down regulatory management on a supranational level.
https://www.imo.org/en/mediacentre/pressbriefings/pages/imo-...
https://www.goodreads.com/series/59006-dr-david-audley-colon...
People of all classes do boorish things regularly. Bringing it up as some kind of gotcha is illustrative of my larger point.
That isn't to say that I enjoy everything they've done. One of the big asks and core areas of empathy is to be understanding of other's faults. Sometimes recognizing our own is a good first step.