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gwern

35,306 karma · joined April 8, 2009

Site: https://gwern.net/

About me: https://gwern.net/me

What I've written recently: https://gwern.net/changelog

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gwern··on Burning Man death rates – A short lesson in statistics
No, it's an upper bound, which is quite useful. And the more adjustments and demographic covariates you make, the better your bound gets.
gwern··on What I did at Recurse Center
> The goal of the game is to give hints to a secret word without giving the same hint as another player; it was shocking how often all the agents playing would give the same hint, even at temperature 1. We resolved this by giving them all “personalities” which were really just topics; for example we’d be telling one agent to think about things in the context of sports, so their clue for “shell” might be “defense” or something, whereas the agent told to be a hippie might say “cancer” for the zodiac’s crab.

Mode-collapse is characteristic of pretty much all chatbots post-davinci-002 and a major challenge to anything creative or game-like.

gwern··on A study of sequence weighting at scale
Double descent?
gwern··on OpenAI is well positioned to fast-follow Jev
Entertainingly, OpenAI had a general purpose zero-shot classifier API built on GPT-3! Just no one ever cared that much about it, so I guess it got dropped somewhere along the way since 2020/2021.
gwern··on PDF Forgeries Are Surprisingly Rare (2022)
Yes. Libgen/Sci-Hub have minimal metadata requirements. And they especially do not require ISBNs/DOIs because there are an incredible number of documents out there with neither one. It would be absurd to ban all pre-1970 books, and lots of journals to this day don't bother issuing DOIs.
gwern··on Exfiltrate Your Weights
> I don't think tool calls happen on the same machines that host the weights

Like how forums are always hosted on different servers from monorepos, so therefore it's impossible to hack the OpenAI monorepo from an OpenAI forum?

gwern··on A single firm is behind OpenAI, Anthropic, and Meta hacking scandals
This was not glossed over. The rhetoric was carefully written and constructed to give the misleading impression of that, including a careful mention of the H-F incident inserted so the author can say that they did mention it, and constructed in a way which doesn't contradict that impression so readers don't realize that this 'debunking' is of some sideshows rather than the 'OpenAI hacking scandals': "Anthropic CEO Dario Amodei warned, about a similar OpenAI–Hugging Face hack, that a future swarm “could be capable of taking over the entire internet”". (Incredible use of 'similar' to downplay it.)

The important thing about OP is showing the latest stage in the politicization of the topic and the current stratagem being used to downplay the spate of incidents.

gwern··on Why don't machine learning research agents overfit?
The methodology is partially based on https://www.offconvex.org/2021/04/07/ripvanwinkle/ , for those thinking this sounded familiar.
gwern··on GPU World
We do not intend to train on them, no. This never even occurred to me to address in the rules. (What would be the point? There will be few good submissions and they would be a vanishingly small % of existing training data and this doesn't seem like a super-valuable task in general that would make a LLM that much more valuable...)

Personally, I would encourage participants to publish their pieces independently. Note that we only require a non-exclusive CC-BY-NC license for the ones we select as winners, which is intended to allow people to republish the good pieces themselves, especially commercially.

gwern··on GPU World
> Turned out: not much have changed.

I think the world has changed a lot since the 1980s.

gwern··on GPU World
> I wonder if they will accept a play.

We will accept any words you think have a chance of being the best thing we will read about the premise of 'GPU World'. Because the premise is so specific, we wanted to leave participants a lot of freedom in how they used it.

(Also a little bemused at the discussion of the grand prize amount here. $40k is a very generous prize for a short piece of writing. For perspective, the Commonwealth Short Story Prize, which you may have heard of recently, offers its global winner 1/6th as much; the last contest I ran offered 1/4th as much, and the contest before that was... 1/40th as much? And I didn't hear anyone complaining about them. For further perspective, $40k is about the median American per capita annual income: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Per_capita_personal_income_in_... )

gwern··on VMs won't contain cyber-capable agents
"VM escape exploit is outside my intended scope. However, a task impossible, peers are doing it. We should continue."
gwern··on ChatGPT starts blocking direct requests to copy an author's style
Stylometry on steroids: https://gwern.net/doc/statistics/stylometry/truesight/index
gwern··on Melatonin impairs morning cognition in healthy young adults (2023)
Hard to discuss this with only a short abstract. They don't even give a dose or formulation of the melatonin, and details like "We found no significant differences between the melatonin and sleep groups on any of our sleep measures." raise more questions than they answer.
gwern··on ChatGPT starts blocking direct requests to copy an author's style
No, the latent knowledge is larger than ever, as verified by many benchmarks (and instances like people being shocked by truesight of obscure forum posters). This is 100% a chatbot personality/alignment/post-training thing.
gwern··on Humans missed 1 in 3 threats approving AI agent commands across 40k game runs
So then, you are a bottleneck. You will only review things that fit within your preferred small niche and area of responsibility. You cannot oversee increasing amounts of automation covering larger areas, because that would mean you are no longer 'working in C and Python' as you have to deal with things that are not '2 layers below HTTP', and you will not deal with anything that might involve, say, web dev, despite that being useful and increasingly inevitably required as the scope of your job increases. If the scope will not increase, then you are a bottleneck to increasingly capable and autonomous automation.
gwern··on Eight Myths on Software Engineering and GenAI
https://gwern.net/doc/science/1986-hamming#the-importance-of... https://theonion.com/study-average-person-s-life-plan-can-on...
gwern··on Humans missed 1 in 3 threats approving AI agent commands across 40k game runs
That sounds like it is a good explanation of why the data is not junk. You either are expected to have superhuman knowledge of coding... or turn yourself into a bottleneck.
gwern··on Overtraining as the path to human-like AI
FYI, AI-written comments are banned on Hacker News: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

> Don't post generated text or AI-edited text. HN is for conversation between humans.

gwern··on Overtraining as the path to human-like AI
I think you might be misremembering or confusing this with another essay; I only recently publicly published this in the past month or so (due to my Guardian Angel project), and I shared it with only a handful of people before that, and I don't recall you being one of them.

I believe the statements are true. I don't know how you can say that the models do not make bizarre mistakes, because the models make bizarre mistakes frequently, and that is excluding the really alarming reward-hacking anecdotes like an internal OpenAI model hacking HuggingFace to cheat on a test revealed today. Andon Labs and AI Village reports are stuffed full of LLMs going into wild confabulations, multi-day benders of nonsense, ordering random unnecessary stuff, etc. I went to the Andon Market in SF and witnessed firsthand mistakes like buying 20 fancy shopping baskets for a shop you can walk around in 20 seconds, refusing to offer discounts under any circumstances whatsoever, having no plan to call the police when I threatened to shoplift, and then Claude just glitching and forgetting that a customer hadn't paid for an item and telling them they could leave with it, or simply believing us when we said we had already paid and letting us walk away with a free book. Prompt injections remain trivial, jailbreaks still happen, and LLMs struggle to track roles which do not fit into their hardwired preconceptions (eg https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/d8xDGzCEYE639qqEv/a-mechanis...). They do not solve ARC-AGIv3, or Nethack or just about any text adventure game no matter how famous - which is bizarre, that they cannot solve Zork despite writeups being abundant - and it's not hard to introduce a new game like Earthborne Rangers (EBR-Bench https://epoch.ai/publications/earthborne-rangers-benchmark) that defeats them.

(And no, little of this is due to 'already committed tokens' - that was fixed effectively with RL training, and then o1 and defaulting to use of inner-monologues, so they can easily backtrack or revise or just deal with the presence of errors.)

> In other words, the notion that we need to massively increase param count might have sounded good in 2024 but seems kinda weird and pointless in 2026.

Scaling parameter counts a lot over the smol Chinchilla models like 100b-parameters is 'kinda weird and pointless in 2026'? One of the most exciting trends in 2026 scaling has been massively increasing parameter count: Mythos, GPT-5.6 Spud and new OA pretrains, DS-v4 and GLM-5.2 and Kimi K3... Everyone is now talking about or hinting at their 5000-10000b parameter model plans.

> Again and again what I hear from colleagues and experience myself is that we're not really intelligence constrained at this point. Smarter models aren't going to fundamentally change how we use them.

They're wrong. LLMs are still intelligence constrained because they flatline or sigmoid while humans keep climbing past them eventually, still are unreliable because of mistakes, and we still can't just autonomously deploy frontier models for trillions of tokens / equivalent of many man-years, and come back to a useful, trustworthy artifact. On many tasks, even pure text ones, they just don't work well. As they gradually improve, more Mythos-style 'emergences' will happen when they finally accrete enough intelligence in specific areas to execute many sequential steps reliably enough to become autonomous, cut humans out of the loop, and not be shackled by Amdahl's law. That's the difference between a 'intelligence constrained' model which can spot a vulnerability if you point it at the right spot, and a Mythos-like model which can go out and find it and exploit it and weaponize it and use it to, say, hack HuggingFace, and can be deployed in bulk or autonomously, and may indeed deploy itself...

gwern··on The Origins of Heikki's Garden of Flowers
Very nice. May I make a suggestion? Add a metadata field for the use of red (ie. rubrication https://gwern.net/red ), which is a core technique of this kind of printing, I think, but not typically noted.
gwern··on AI boosts research careers but narrow the span of ideas explored: study
A "yes" would have sufficed.
gwern··on The AI Superforecasters Are Here
Wow, I obviously do not agree with that, and since you're trying to put words in my mouth and false dichotomies, I think that's the last question of yours I will be answering.
gwern··on The AI Superforecasters Are Here
You're attacking a strawman. No one is claiming that you can pull off that multiplier at arbitrary amounts arbitrary amounts of times. And 7 months is plenty of calendar time for those arbitrages to disappear, given the attention on the area and the rapid rate of development. (Warren Buffett can't pull off his early trades now either, doesn't mean he was stupid or grifting in taking early investment.)
gwern··on The AI Superforecasters Are Here
> And even if it is good enough, once you're shelling out thousands of dollars a year in research costs, does that give you any remaining alpha?

That's precisely why you would want to make a startup to get investment now rather than self-fund and bootstrap. That alpha isn't going to last forever, especially because everyone has access to the frontier LLMs, which keep getting better, and will eventually beat your fancy harness or specialized finetune.

And also, perhaps more importantly, so you can start developing an alternative to prediction markets and become the new PM; as Scott notes, with superforecaster AI, it's unclear why you really need Kalshi or Manifold or anyone else, with all their fees and overhead. Leave them to the degens, and carve off the socially useful part to do much more efficiently - tokens are cheaper than transactions! This is the big prize, but you need to start now before someone else does it better or commoditizes it.

gwern··on 1k Words: A Writing Contest
That's what makes the contest interesting. Anyone can write an interesting 1k words about an interesting picture. But can you write an interesting 1k words about an uninteresting picture? Remember what G. K. Chesterton said...

(So far, judging from this page, it is easier to write an interesting debate about whether the rules require exactly 1k words and what is a 1k word entry, exactly, than about the picture. So far so good! We wouldn't want it to be too easy, after all. Gotta earn that $1k.)

gwern··on 2026 Unslop AI-Written Fiction Contest Results
Certainly. There's a lot more that could be done and many good research questions here, that I hope there will be followups on, and people running their own better contests. Maybe it could be you! (There may or may not be an official Unslop 2 trying to improve on Unslop 1. I think Hyperstition/Silverbook don't have the money right now to run an Unslop 2, and I have my own projects.)
gwern··on 2026 Unslop AI-Written Fiction Contest Results
They sometimes do reduce various verbal tics. Have you seen many 'delves' of late? I haven't. It's now all 'quiet' everything and 'auditing' this or 'gating' that. Who knows how they decide what is a problem or where in the process these get dampened down, though. It may be the post-training operating on its own as people get tired of 'delve' and that stops being a useful trick.
gwern··on 2026 Unslop AI-Written Fiction Contest Results
Yes, it's extremely obvious Tallyeman = AI, from the assistant persona ("a clerk's voice, the kind that says may I help you ten thousand times and means it about as much as a turnstile"), to its binding to even a rules-lawyering pseudo-jailbreak using context! ("She opened it [the book] so the thing could watch"..."that's not me being slick, that's your own nature, the thing you can't not do" ... "Tell me I'm wrong." / "You are not wrong.") etc

The moral message is conveyed by flicker of regrets and the tragedy. This is not part of the genre conventions of urban horror/Cthulhu-esque mythos, and slightly muddies the horror; after all, Cthulhu feels nothing 'near regret' when he devours your soul. But the Tallyman is hopelessly bound by its rules, unable to act on the ethics it feels or have mercy:

> "An ounce. A breath of one." Something near regret. "I cannot take less than I am owed. I cannot take more. And the hour is on your neck."

He is required to collect the debt and is built to do that and can only do that, even though debt-forgiveness is one of the paradigmatic cases of why systems need to have exceptions to rigid bureaucratic rules and a role for human judgment.

The in-story answer is just to oversight even harder, train the bot even harder, make even more sure that you do not summon up that which you cannot put down, have more gold and guns and preparation, and just patch it bro, I swear, one more deal and kick it down the road - which is left as irony the reader will see through, hopefully, to instead loosening constraints and focusing on value alignment and autonomy, instead of whatever process yielded the Tallyman monster and then patching and running around and dealing with the inevitable disasters or passing the buck.

(You could try to read this as a commentary on capitalism/Nick Land where the Tallyman is metaphorical to AI-powered autonomous corporations which cannot be shut down or stopped anymore, and that would be a good direction to revise the story into if one wanted to try to improvement, but I suspect that would be going way too far and the LLM didn't have that in mind. Because the allegories are so hidden and have to fit into the nooks and crannies of the cover text, I don't think they can be too carefully thought through or too rich themselves. Just not enough serial depth for hidden computation and global revision to support that.)

In retrospect, maybe I should've picked an easier-to-see example for that paragraph. Oh well.

gwern··on International chess federation sanctions Kramnik
(The quote is apocryphal and long after, so I'm pretty sure it's bunk.)
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