_vvaw

The study was commissioned by the NHS and led by Dr. Hilary Cass, past president of the Royal College of Paediatrics and Child Health:

https://www.england.nhs.uk/commissioning/spec-services/npc-c...

It shut Tavistock, highlighted diagnostic overshadowing of co-morbind conditions such as abuse, trauma, and autism, found gross evidentiary gaps in the medical arguments for puberty blockers and youth HRT, and recommended the curtailment of medical youth transition. The move to multiple clinics is one part trans activists highlight while ignoring the rest.

Over the past week I’ve read enough on and about Kiwi Farms to conclude that while “doxing” does happen there, as it does on Twitter and other websites, the claims of harassment and SWATing and users driving people to suicide are highly and cynically exaggerated. The evidence simply doesn’t support these claims, particularly the suicides:

https://archive.ph/JPHtM

The main issue seems to be that Kiwi Farms documents the actual, public behavior of many disgusting, pedophilic, embarrassing people on the Internet, some of whom are trans. Some of the people they document and laugh at are also neo-Nazis or alt-right. Some of the Kiwi Farms users are trans.

The willingness of many in news media and at companies like Cloudflare to take these claims of SWATing and harassment at face value with next to no evidence, or in the face of obvious sock-puppet posts to Kiwi Farms that are instantly removed by moderators, has been disheartening. It reminds me how r/againsthatesubreddit mods posted CASM to conservative subreddits to get them banned by site admins. I increasingly understand that the opponents of Kiwi Farms use the exact same tactics they project onto the site: doxing and SWATing Joshua Moon, harassing him and Kiwi Farms, spreading false information about the site’s content and activities. Their goal seems to be wiping evidence of child grooming, illegal drug distribution to minors, and other very bad and embarrassing behavior by their community from the web. They may succeed.

I hope reasonable members of the trans community can distance themselves sufficiently from these unstable activists. I hope people like Keffals have their unsavory activities documented and shared with a wider audience. I hope this mob of unscrupulous activists doesn’t succeed in controlling all speech on the Internet.

So the trans community stands with Keffals, a documented child groomer and provider of puberty blockers + hormones to minors behind their parents' backs?

https://archive.ph/HY4hK

Promoter (again, to children) of sketchy Internet pharmacies that sell hormones with anime lolita box art and labels that say “keep away from parents”?

https://archive.ph/zZMRp

The threat was also quite clearly unserious.

>Of course, but I think a threat to kill someone with a bomb is unambiguously threatening and intimidating

The "bomb threat" was posted by a recently-created and otherwise inactive account, immediately flagged by multiple users, and deleted by a moderator within minutes. The user who posted it was immediately banned. It was also clearly unserious.

https://archive.ph/damIX

He has already been swatted multiple times. In the past trans activists have shown up at his house with weapons, looking for him. Keffals doxed his mom on Twitter a few days ago, posting her full face photo and calling for her firing while lying about her links (there are none) to her son's website:

https://archive.ph/15nHu

> (a) There is no independent verification of those claims against Keffals

There absolutely is. The DIY HRT Directory website is live right now, as are Keffals' tweets and Twitch clips promoting it. The sexual tweets directed at minors are archived on archive.ph, as are Keffals' doxing of the KF owner's mom and Keffal's calls for SWAting and doxing. The "Catboy Ranch" screenshots and Kiwi Farms investigation prompted Keffals to wipe the server. It's impossible to save Discord content on third-party archival services, but tweets between Discord users from that period buttress the allegations.

"There is freedom of speech, but I cannot guarantee freedom after speech." —https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idi_Amin

Kiwi Farms users are anonymous too. The owner of KF regularly cooperates with American law enforcement.

And I think you should read this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32712037

And this: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32728365

The fight over Kiwi Farms' Wikipedia page is intense. Keffals, a central figure to this story described in the second link above, is now quoting the Wikipedia page as fact because it quotes an NBC News story which quotes... Keffals. If you don't rely strictly on primary sources it's impossible to determine truth in this situation.

In terms of SWATing, harassment, and "driving people to suicide" this is a false impression, one that is intentionally spread by the site's detractors. SWATing and harassment is strictly banned on Kiwi Farms. The site owner aggressively removes such posts and cooperates with law enforcement.

The leader of the campaign to take down Kiwi Farms is Keffals, a transsexual Twitch streamer with a large underage audience. Kiwi Farms has documented Keffals’ sexualized interactions with underage members of her community, as well as her history in porn and online interactions with several open pedophiles. Some believe this is why she wants the site nuked.

See archived copy of the Kiwi Farms thread for documentation of Keffals' encouragement of doxing and SWATing, sexual grooming of minors on the “Catboy Ranch” Discord server, and her website which instructs minors on how to secretly obtain and self-dose cross-sex hormones behind parents’ backs:

https://archive.ph/HY4hK

The sketchy online pharmacy Keffals’ DIY HRT Directory promotes sells cross-sex hormones marketed to children, with holofoil anime lolita box art and labels that say “keep away from parents”:

https://archive.ph/zZMRp

The medical consequences of a confused child self-dosing puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones outside parental and medical supervision can be sterilizing, irreversible, and lifelong. Keffals promotes the DIY HRT Directory on Twitter and Twitch to a huge audience of underaged viewers.

None of these details about Keffals were mentioned in WaPo or NBC accounts of this story. It is incredibly dismaying to see Keffals doing this to children, well-documented and for the most part out in the open, and realize that no one in the news media cares.

===

EDIT: In response to a comment below...

KF's owner refused the New Zealand's government command to remove Brenton Tarrant's manifesto and shooting video. This demand was not backed up by American law. He cooperates with law enforcement requests for information on criminal threats and illegal material posted to Kiwi Farms.

SWATing and harassment is explicitly prohibited on Kiwi Farms, and the site owner aggressively removes such content. "Doxing" is for better or worse not a crime, and is practiced by the very same people currently crying for Kiwi Farms' deletion.

What they were doing was not a crime, as evidenced by every lawsuit against the site getting thrown out and the owner's extensive cooperation with law enforcement.

The line with "Kiwi Farms is responsible for 3 suicides" seems to be repeating that lie until it sticks. The truth is more complicated:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32712037

It got named because the alleged attacker called the police and said "it was me, Kiwi Farms user so-and-so." The user in question denied making this call and claimed they had been impersonated. This happened in the midst of the pressure campaign on Cloudflare, to a GOP House member known for jumping the gun who had no prior history with Kiwi Farms. If that's not extremely suspect I don't know what is.

>Nobody was ever able to get any of the documentation listed on this page from the Japanese side, even family

Do you mean the allegedly-deceased person's family has been unable to confirm their death with the government? This seems like a significant fact I have not seen reported. Do you have a link for this claim?

You’re making specious arguments, engaging in ad hominem, ignoring scientific evidence that you disagree with, and generalizing your individual experience to millions of unrelated minors. I have no intention of engaging with a bad-faith respondent.

Update: I am amazed and disappointed.

I don’t know how we’re still retreating to “private companies can do what they want” in the free speech debate on HN. It’s clear that those who want Kiwi Farms gone are resorting to illegal means such as DDoSing to get what they want. A very small number of companies like Cloudflare can effectively defend against this. In this position they act as utilities, a category of private businesses that is held to strict standards of free speech. Sadly the law has not caught up to this reality.

In their market position, Cloudflare has the power of a small government. In American capitalist society in particular, there’s increasingly no daylight between large corporations and the government. If the big companies say you can’t speak, what good is the right?

What Cloudflare appears to have done is cave to a Twitter mob in violation of their own stated principles and common sense. This has irreparably harmed not only Cloudflare’s reputation, but the prospects for free and open speech on the Internet.

Bomb threats, real world harassment and fake calls to the police are strictly banned on Kiwi Farms. Making fun of transsexuals is not. Nor is the latter illegal, as much as some in this case and in this comment section wish it were.

You didn’t though. It is obvious you have an attitude towards the access of underage children to cross-sex hormones and puberty blockers that differs from that of evidence-based medicine, such as that practiced in Sweden or the UK where such access has been severely curtailed.

Calling well-established science replicated over many years and large-n studies “dodgy” simply doesn’t make it so.

There are many archived Twitter posts where the owners of this site (Keffals and Chloe aka bobposting) brag about supplying minors with hormones behind parents’ backs, even sending these drugs to children directly which is highly illegal. The top “Homebrew” online pharmacy they link to sells cross-sex hormones in holofoil boxes clearly marketed to children, decorated with lolita anime art and “Keep Away from Parents” labels:

https://archive.ph/zZMRp

Hardly surprising given the sexualized Discord server called “Catboy Ranch” where Keffals, who is nearly 30, led many underage viewers down the path of medical gender transition. Some were as young as 13. Keffals sent them collars to show they were Keffals’ pets. Users engaged in sexual talk and discussed taking naked selfies. Ctrl+F “Catboy”):

https://archive.ph/HY4hK

I believe Kiwi Farms’ investigation of this activity, as well as Keffals’ failed career as a niche porn actress, are why Keffals seeks to get the site taken down. Of course, all this has been saved across multiple archive services and will never go away.

Kiwi Farms is back on an alternate domain.

Posters in the Keffals thread believe the fake bomb threat was to blame for Cloudflare’s reaction. The account which made the post barely had any other activity on the site. The post itself was removed quickly by moderators. If it’s true that an obvious fake bomb threat which was swiftly removed was the cause for this action, Cloudflare has some hard explaining to do to its remaining customers. Fake anonymous posts and an ideological Twitter mob can apparently DoS your entire operation with Cloudflare.

If the threat was something else, I and other customers would love to learn exactly what it was.

You can visit the archive links and live site yourself, the blog I mentioned adds nothing new. I mentioned them to illustrate the lack of attention paid to this point by the media; only such an obscure, relatively partisan blog has picked it up (so far).

She published LoTT’s full legal name and enough of a description to positively locate her on Spokeo/White Pages/etc. That is a common cop-out for Twitter mobs; posting the ready-made parts for such a search but not the actual home address, so in the poster’s eyes it technically isn’t “doxing.”

Do you have sources for Byuu/Near spotted alive? First I’ve heard of it.

”Unmasking” is merely code for “doxing someone we don’t like.” Someone’s full legal name is all you really need to look them up on people-finder websites, which IMO are the real problem and in urgent need of regulation.

Neither of those incidents took place in the last 48 hours, or have been definitively attributed to Kiwi Farms.

What was the actual threat? Was it posted on Kiwi Farms, or transmitted via another channel?

Keffals decided to leave North America after one SWATing of unknown attacker provenance. Josh Moon, owner of Kiwi Farms, has been SWATed numerous times (as have been many larger Twitch streamers) and even had trans activists show up at his house with weapons.