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Comment by cluok | Hacker News Reader

Why would you degrade yourself by begging for a pay rise and using your wife / marriage / family plans as a way to show your vulnerability?

Begging and using your family situation for anything is beta. You need to step up and use your power to get more money. If you're not paid enough; LEAVE! Grow a backbone.

Real career progression doesn't happen off the back of begging. I certainly won't take you seriously for any position of power if you try and beg your way there.

I don't care about your family plans, I care about the value you bring to me. Be valuable, be alpha, be worth what you're asking for or fuck right off.

Down vote and censor my language all you want; you don't win by being a whining ass bitch.

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Great advice here, need more money? Just "use your power". Thanks bro.

Would love to know how much "power" you actually wield. I suspect not much.

Firstly, I'm fairly senior in a large consultancy; make of that what you will.

Secondly; I mean the power and influence that you have in your company, if you have no influence in your company, then at least you have some power in your market. Your employer is not the only one in your city and moving usually gives you a pay bump. Just don't go fucking begging, you're a professional and you're worth money.... bro.....

> fairly senior in a large consultancy

Which could easily mean "frustrated and impotent mid-level at a soul-draining mega-conglomerate dinosaur", which would certainly shed some light on your posturing behavior.

But to the point, I don't see anyone advocating whinging or begging, that interpretation was tacked on by you and your alpha-beta nonsense. Bro.

Stop making assumptions about me. You don't know me.

Do you really think that whining about your wife and your family plans isn't begging? Please sir... can I have more?

Ask for what you deserve or go and get it elsewhere.

Asking for more because you are about to have a family is begging, it comes across as asking for a favour. Your boss, or his boss, or the boss you don't like may grant you the pay rise but you're positioning it as a market average pay rise at best or a favour which you owe gratitude for at worse.

If you are worth more, tell me why and ask for it like an adult; don't bullshit me, I know your worth and so do you; if we disagree on that point, prove me wrong or get another job in this incredibly liquid market.

IT guys are fucking terrible at negotiating. This letter and your response to me are classic examples.

Getting a lot of projection out of you; you sound quite bitter. Actual employers love it when employees start families and it is worth extra money, but I won't waste my breath explaining the subtleties of that to you. It's too bad we can't all just be alpha for money like you; I'm sure we'd love to read your blog post telling us how.

Everyone is different. I personally don't consider talking about why a raise is important to you, in a human way, is a bad thing. I wouldn't want to work for someone who thinks that what is most important to me in life is irrelevant at work.

I had that bit as optional because some people want to keep stuff like that out of it, which is fine.

The overall gist is that when making your case, if you truly like your company and want to stay, you do not want to come off as an arrogant, greedy asshole who is up for grabs to the highest bidder. You should come across as a loyal, enthusiastic, high performer who simply wants the salary (or possibly promotion) they deserve.

Sometimes getting you a raise will require your boss having to fight a battle for budget, and to do that, it helps if they actually like and respect you as a person as well as value you as an employee.

I have gotten many raises over my career, so this approach has worked for me. However, every situation and person is unique.

@juliangregorian - Not sure why I can't reply directly to your post so I'll quote you here then reply

"Getting a lot of projection out of you; you sound quite bitter. Actual employers love it when employees start families and it is worth extra money, but I won't waste my breath explaining the subtleties of that to you. It's too bad we can't all just be alpha for money like you; I'm sure we'd love to read your blog post telling us how."

Why are you making this about me? Like I said, you don't know me.

How do you know companies like it when employees start families? That's highly subjective and down to the company; it also has nothing to do with what we're talking about. Having a family does not mean you are worth more to a business. Do you have any idea how many days I've taken off to look after my sick kids?

You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.

You are a highly paid professional with one of the most in demand skills in the modern world. Act like it.

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