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Comment by rvdm | Hacker News Reader

While this made me laugh because it's an exact description of the last 3 years of my professional life, I am happy new frameworks keep popping up. The holy grail of front end frameworks hasn't been invented yet but with each new framework we ( hopefully ) make some progress.

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I wonder if you've looked at riot.js[r]? I ask, because I've so far steered clear of js-heavy front-end development -- and in my search so far, it seems the best among simple, plain js frameworks. I'll probably end up playing with elm, or do something with clojure-script -- but riot.js checks a lot of boxes:

  * Is dogfooded for a real app by authors (muut.com
      Discussion-as-a-Service)
  * Is small (code size and file size)
  * Is simple
  * Avoids(?) being simplistic (too simple)
  * Has an idea of components

Maybe not enough though... looks like js is rediscovering object-oriented MVC design slowly (a sane way to keep the html templates, the event listener/handling code and any needed css in one place).

I think polymer might be the closest alternative, but muut has a comparison that doesn't speak too well for polymer: https://muut.com/riotjs/compare.html

[r] https://muut.com/riotjs/

Just out of curiosity, what constitutes a holy grail framework in your opinion? Has the holy grail of back end framework been invented? Is it ruby on rails or django? How about the holy grail of database engine, build system, etc.

I don't think there's exactly one way of doing anything, there may be leaders in some spaces but I doubt any of them are considered holy grails. Pick the tool that best fits the problem at the time and don't wait for a potential holy grail in the future.

> The holy grail of front end frameworks hasn't been invented yet but with each new framework we ( hopefully ) make some progress.

I gave up that hope. The holy grail seems to have been reached (and lost) with Smalltalk and its image-based introspective runtime.

It has been invented[1] and we're bandwagoneering[2, 3] it for you:

1. http://reagent-project.github.io/

2. http://www.meetup.com/Reagent-Minimalistic-React-for-Clojure...

3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DYzwfekWSzQ

Amazing, a homepage for a js front-end framework that actually has useful content with js disabled, like a web page (as perhaps, opposed to a web app) should.

I really like the concepts and simplicity you propose, but I don't think the issue lies with the framework developers.

The web is still really young and the standard organizations are still figuring out what HTML / CSS / JS / etc… are all about.

And I'm totally fine with that, we live in such an exciting time. It's like being around when written language was invented. Except with computers.

What really matters is how to divide a problem into separate and loosely connected parts. I have my own home-built version too.

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