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Comment by toomuchtodo | Hacker News Reader

The insurance does cover it, although fuel exhaustion is very much pilot error.

Sometimes it is pilot error, but apparently not in this case. Seems to be a failure in the ferry tank pumps according to comments on avcanada.

Or it's an insurance scam because the owner needed some cash. A staged accident in the middle of an ocean is a nice way to pull that off.

Yeah, but a staged accident in the middle of an ocean sounds pretty unsafe, too.

Ditching small planes has something like a 90% survival rate, and that includes planes that ditched in much worse situations.

For someone in a bad enough situation that they are willing to commit insurance fraud by faking a crash, it probably is a pretty good risk.

See this earlier comment for a link to data on small plane ditching: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8957313

That said, insurance companies aren't stupid. Would they really let the person insure the plane for so much that it is better to lose it for insurance than to simply sell it?

Not at all. GA aircraft have slow stall speeds, and as you can see from both scenarios, first-responder response time is extremely quick when you follow protocol. The Cirrus even has an airframe parachute for a soft landing.

Not for nothing, but Vso (stall speed with full flaps) in the CIrrus SR22 is still 59 knots (68mph/109kmh) and remember airframes don't have the same crash safety features that automobiles do. It's a lot slower than an airliner's would be but you're not exactly gently touching down.

The Cirrus SR22 airframe parachute ensures a soft, slow landing.

These are not unsurvivable forces we're talking about.

Ray Clamback, one of the more experienced ferry pilots (300 US->AU deliveries from memory) went into the drink off Hawaii on two separate occasions and had to tread water for 10 and 6 hours respectively. Nothing "safe" about it.

I never understood why they don't just strap them on a ship and send them out as project cargo. Or take the wings off and containerize. That's done all the time for Yachts which are perfectly able to be sailed to destination. Only real difference is how long it takes but a modern container liner is suprisingly fast.

Time and money.

For example, to ship a new Cirrus SR20 to Australia starts at $28,995 and you'll need to wait for factory reassembly and certification. To ferry the same aircraft costs $22,800.

By far the biggest risk in ditching is drowning. This guy was a highly experienced ferry pilot, so he knew precisely what he was doing.

there was a member of Microsoft Pilots that did exactly that. Faked a crash on land as prep, crashed in Elliot Bay and swam to the house of his ex and "stole" a car in an attempt and insurance fraud.

Are realtime wind maps and forecasts over the pacific accurate enough for planes of that size?

I'd imagine a strong enough headwind would burn through your fuel pretty quickly.

Flying from the mainland to Hawaii you require a large margin due to wind uncertainty. Between Kauai and Oahu, not so much...

Edit: This story is about someone flying from Hawaii to California where the flight ended up taking 4 hours longer than expected due to unexpected headwind. Luckily for him, he was in an airplane with extremely long range and had planned to fly directly to Oshkosh, WI! http://www.ez.org/t/cp34-p3

That's a wonderful story. I'm not sure what I like most, the electronics troubleshooting, the perils of pre-GPS navigation over the ocean, or the cavilier-but-thoughtful approach to solving all sorts of problems encountered along the way. Thanks for posting it.

When you get your private pilots license, the rule is "always keep flying". No matter what problem you have, as long as you have altitude and speed first, you've got time to solve whatever the problem is.

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