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First off, you are using a TON of blaming statements (which are mostly ad hominem) and are using a trolling technique to attempt poll others for feelings. It's a nasty habit and your comments only serve to make someone angry. I believe you are aware of your intent and only use it to illicit fear.

We still have enough liberty here that this article can run in the newspaper freely. That is evidence enough America is far from stinky. Do we have unfair levers of power here? Yes. Are we attempting to determine how the levers got into a few people's control? Yes. Will we figure out how to stop them and keep it from happening again? You bet we will.

And none of that will come to pass because of your crappy comments. It'll happen because we are Americans and aren't going to allow our liberties to being eroded by a bunch of fear mongering asshats. And THAT, my friends, is a blaming statement.

Eh, their post was their opinion, and they've got some decent points. Your accusation of ad hominem is misapplied--go look it up.

The observation was made that the real damage to the US would come from within and not without. This seems trivially easy to "prove" if you keep up with the news and history.

The observation was made that broad swathes of government and private practice were in league to perpetuate these issues. Such behavior is expected because of the mechanism of action at work: the rot and the power is in the legislative and judicial systems, so of course those folks will be acting in concert.

The observation was made that in other "corrupt" countries officers routinely relieve travelers of excess pecuniary baggage, which appears to also be the case in some parts of the US.

These are not ad hominem propositions, nor were they presented as such.

> their post was their opinion

This is a false statement. "Your country is beginning to stink." is a blaming statement that attempts to lay out pre-support of the opinion "In many respects it is worse than third world countries". However, in the subsequent context in which it is used the statement is presented as a logical conclusion or fact. It is then followed up with another blaming statement meant to seal the 'logic' of the opinion, "It looks like it is not terrorists who are going to destroy America after all. Your corrupt governments, banks, judiciary and law enforcement will do it on their own."

There is no proof that America will be destroyed by corruption inside government, banks or the judicial system. There are observations that we are threatened by some individual's actions, but there are also observations we are doing something about it. The claims we will be 'destroyed' because we are 'corrupt as a third world country' are simply false. There is no evidence this will occur and it is pure conjecture.

While I agree with you it probably started as an opinion the comment, in general, their comments consititued an irrelevant conclusion. Irrelevant because it was full of blaming opinion from someone outside those being blamed, and conclusion because it was presented as fact. As it turns out, irrelevant conclusions fall into a broad of set of relevance fallacies, which themselves are 'ad hominem' arguments. Look it up.

Wait, an article balances out the police seizing private assets without a crime for 3 decades to the tune of a hundred million dollars a year?

There's something wrong when police have been funding themselves with $30 billion in essentially stolen money.

> we are Americans and aren't going to allow our liberties to being eroded by a bunch of fear mongering asshats

I can't count how many times I've heard this comment along the lines of "hurr durr this is Murica and no one is taking muh freedom away". No, your freedoms are already gone and it looks like you haven't woken up to it yet.

> "hurr durr this is Murica and no one is taking muh freedom away"

You really don't need to use language like this. This isn't Reddit.

I think you don't really get my point. Many countries don't have any meaningful rights or rule of law of any kind. There are many countries whose citizens will not challenge the authorities in any form or manner, because the systems give them no redress against any abuse of power. Even if they are rich the legal systems don't exist. Witness Khordovsky and his problems with the Russian government.

In America these institutions exist, but the legislatures have turned them into revenue collecting bodies for the federal,state, local governments and the law enforcement bodies.

It is like law enforcement and the legal system have turned into feeding troughs for the whole band of officials involved in it.

If you are not rich enough to give your lawyer a fair share of what they steal from you, you are not getting it back. If you are rich enough they don't bother stealing from you because they know you have the power to get it back.

This sucks. Apparently police and prison officers unions and PACS or whatever their called fund political campaigns which result in preserved or even bigger budgets for law enforcement, then turn around and use the increased income to fund the politicians next time around, to keep the cycle going (except Detroit), which results in more borrowing by the government from which the banks also get their share, pauperising future generations even more.

It is an interesting country.

> I think you don't really get my point.

I don't think you get mine about speaking for others and making blaming statements. You can't say what I get or what I don't get, nor can you form blaming opinions and then try to speak them as fact. This behavior itself is where problems start, not where they are ended. This has nothing to do with the topic at hand and everything to do with solid lines of communication between those that agree to disagree.

I hear you when you say we have problems. We do. Like other countries, we have certain traits that make up who we are as a culture. Part of our culture, at least historically, is firmly objecting to too much government control. Given the recent reaction to the NSA's overreach, I'd say we are moving forward on the issue. Unfortunately for the impatient, this can be painful. We're also know for dragging our feet and whining about change while it is occurring. We're not perfect, but we're trying.

Yea, it's not great anymore, but with the exception of France; it's still the better alternative. That Governor who was caught taking money made me proud of our system. As to the whole Cop problem--I don't have any answers, except buy dash cams.(If you drive a vechicle). The more outrageous footage we have of these guys abusing their power the Better.

Yes, whatever you do, please don't come here on a visa. It's awful. Terrible. A horrible, nasty place. Run away, far, far away while you still can. You should never come here. Tell all your friends.

Disgusted by it? Yes. Ashamed? No. "Ashamed" implies that I expect better, or that I am responsible, neither of which are the case.

I like most of my neighbors, and I am proud of what our country aspires to. Alas, the rich and powerful are a huge lot of real assholes. So, yes, we're a bit overdue for another round to take them down a notch or two.

Once in a while, things do happen in the U.S. to piss off the assholes:

* abolished slavery

* gave women the right to vote

* changed tax structure to try to encourage more of a meritocracy (alas, largely rolled back)

* overturned prohibition (again, losing ground due to war on drugs leading to Al Capone 2.0)

(maybe only once every two generations or so, but there you go)

Alas, there's a list of screwups that could parallel the above list, but we're trying...

You're mostly correct in your descriptions of justice in the USA. However, as an USAian I don't feel ashamed, because I don't feel responsible. I just live here. I certainly would like the USA to suck less, but translating that into shame is something that just doesn't happen in my head.

I also don't blame people for the terrible places in which they live either. I don't blame anyone for any repressive regime in which they might live. It's not fair and it's unproductive. I feel my decision to not blame people for any repressive regime they might live under is important to reforming those regimes, and ultimately having sympathy for those regimes' targets.

Don't come here. It's terrible. Just terrible. Do not apply for a visa here. It's a TRAP!

I'm a well educated and skillful professional and can do my job from basically anywhere in the world. I wouldn't even vacation in the US. I am terrified of the legal framework I would subject myself to, especially as a citizen. I'm perfectly willing to work for clients in the US, but face to face meeting will take place OUTSIDE the US.

Don't come here. Don't even work for US clients. They are nasty, nasty I tell you. I'm one of them.

It's not too bad as long as you're rich and white.