Comment by theboss | Hacker News Reader

Comment by theboss | Hacker News Reader

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cross fit is really an infiritating thing. The people who do it are sometimes diehard fans with absolutely no knowledge of how to build strength or an "elite athlete". A lot of people just like the brand...

But the diehard fans aren't the worst part. Cross fit the organization loves to shut people down who speak poorly of them. They also have made a lot of unsubstantiated claims about the type of results that can be expected by following cross fit programming (which is laughably bad). Its also thought that they run the cross fit games unfairly since there is a conflict of interest in sponsoring their top athletes and putting on the cross fit games where their sponsored athletes and no sponsored compete.

The worst part is the bad programming and the dangers of having a coach who is instructing you to do things that are obviously bad ideas. Extremely high rep oly lifting is a reciepe for disaster since the lifts are very skill based.

With all that said. One thing about cross fit is really good. They have got people training with barbells and started a lot of people down a path where they can start getting information they need to train better and smarter. But I'll be saving my 100 a month..

As an outsider, a LOT of the backlash against crossfit seems to be snootiness from traditional weightlifters who seem confused that crossfit is not trying to be powerlifting or bodybuilding, although many of the same exercises are used. Crossfit looks to be a kind of sports conditioning training, and as such of course it's going to involve higher intensity, shorter rests and higher reps.

Now I don't know how possible it is to design a safe weights workout in those circumstances. There are almost certainly exercises that shouldn't be done quickly, or shouldn't be done tired, or shouldn't be done without perfect form. And almost certainly people are doing those exercises in crossfit gyms quickly, or when tired, or without perfect form, and increasing their risk of injury as a result.

But in a perfect world those people would __still be training that way__, albeit with better instructors and choice of exercises. Because it suits them to train for their sports or general fitness. They're not going to all change their minds one day and become powerlifters.

>Crossfit looks to be a kind of sports conditioning training, and as such of course it's going to involve higher intensity, shorter rests and higher reps.

That's kind of the problem, though. Because Crossfit is somewhat randomized, your body never really gets adapted to actually become conditioned.

Mark Rippetoe -- who was associated with Crossfit in its early years -- has a pretty decent rundown here:

http://www.t-nation.com/training/crossfit-the-good-bad-and-t...

>But in a perfect world those people would __still be training that way__, albeit with better instructors and choice of exercises.

I think this is one of the things that bothers a lot of people - a lot of the people doing Crossfit would not be doing explosive barbell lifts otherwise, and they especially wouldn't have a trainer telling them to do them to high reps under time pressure.

Like the article I linked says, it's great that Crossfit has gotten more people into barbell training. It's just the way it's gotten them into it that's worrisome.

As a powerlifter, my beef with crossfit is that people think they can learn how to be expert lifters in a weekend in a class of 20 people. Learning to deadlift properly takes months even under personalized instruction; learning to squat with perfect form takes much longer; and learning to properly perform olympic lifts like the clean and jerk takes the longest. This also assumes that the new lifter is even capable of performing the movement (many have weak lower backs and mobility issues which need to be addressed on an individual level before they can start performing powerlifts or olympic lifts).

The notion that you will be able to immediately perform these lifts competently is absurd as the author points out, and putting new lifters in scenarios where there is minimal personal instruction with a goal of speed and high repetition instead of proper execution of the lift is a recipe for injury. As someone who has gotten injured even when performing powerlifts with proper technique, seeing other people put themselves in situations where they are going to get hurt + advocating that others do so actively annoys me.

Also, I take issue with the fact that you assume that my dislike for crossfit is rooted in some sort of powerlifting elitism. This couldn't be farther from the truth. I fully support almost any lifting modality which gets people in the gym and lifting safely (bodybuilding, powerlifting, olympic lifting, weight lifting, strong man, general strength training etc), but I can't abide by the popularization of a program whose implementation frequently leads to injury and incorrect form.

Like I said, there are a lot of reasons for backlash. I didn't even touch on most of them.

I disagree that their goal is "Sports conditioning training". Because this is not consistent with their who their clientele is. Their vast majority of their clientele is average people, with no prior lifting experience, who have heard of it.

From my cursory run-ins with either community I would say the "snootiness" has very little to do with the fact they train differently and quite a lot with the fact they often train poorly.

Additionally you are creating a ridiculous dichotomy between crossfit and powerlifting. There is such a thing as doing exercises with proper form without necessarily doing 500lbs deadlifts.

That being said I'm sure there are many decent cross-fit gyms where injury and bad form are not a problem - and the exercises they do, particularly the gymnastics aspects are incredibly impressive. Of course you could get those benefits from - you know - doing gymnastics in combination with your workout. And you'd probably be safer off on average.

> snootiness from traditional weightlifters who seem confused that crossfit is not trying to be powerlifting or bodybuilding

I'm impressed at how you managed to conflate three distinct sports in a sentence.

On a logical basis my statement is fine. I could have written 'snowboarders who seem confused that crossfit is not trying to be canoeing or flower arranging.' :-)

But yes, apologies for my poor terminology.

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