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Comment by anon4 | Hacker News Reader

Yeah, but in Ukraine, they're digging themselves out of a much deeper hole. If they manage to get accepted in the EU, a lot of them would emigrate west. USA citizens don't have that option. There isn't a "west" for someone from the USA to emigrate to. USA is the west.

You shouldn't compare your corruption with Ukraine's or other Soviet Bloc countries'. Those people have a place to run to, as hard as getting there is. You have nowhere to run.

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There's plenty of Western countries that are less screwed up than the US.

For example? What's involved for a citizen of the United States who would like to settle in one of those countries permanently?

I know plenty of US citizens that have emigrated to Canada, via school or work related methods. It's not particularly hard, it just takes time for the paperwork to clear.

Get a job, get a green card, wait five years, get your citizenship.

That first step is a challenge but if you're the type who reads Hacker News you're better off than most. My green card application for Ireland was approved yesterday. (Yes yes Ireland has numerous flaws - I still vastly prefer life here).

Or this if you can work for yourself. The requirements are pretty easy to satisfy.

http://www.pond-crosser.com/northern-europe/netherlands/dutc...

HUGE DISCLAIMER

Pond-crosser is a site I recently started. Even so I can't imagine it being more applicable.

How about Germany. I'm in Berlin, although I even thought about moving to USA in the past (I also had a few decent job offers in Vally). As a side note: I'm not German.

USA looks increasingly like a place that must exist and I'll need to visit from time to time, but I'd prefer for all the conferences and everything else to be somewhere else if possible...

Norway, Sweden, Finland, Denmark, Netherlands.

Hell, even Switzerland.

They do not want immigrants, they have problems enough with the ones they got recently

My bet is they'll take educated American immigrants happily.

Then you don't know the Swiss.

True, I was mostly guessing. I am surprised to hear this.

That's not the case in my experience. Anecdotal, but I worked at a company where the brunt of the downturn layoffs fell disproportionately on people who needed work Visas, which have become much more difficult to justify in the current climate. AFAIK nothing's changed in that respect.

Google "Dutch American Friendship Treaty" If Netherlands interests you.

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