Comment by wpietri | Hacker News Reader

Comment by wpietri | Hacker News Reader

Parent Full thread

Since you're a native, maybe you can address something subtle: the extent to which the business community favors positive-sum vs zero-sum thinking, and innovation over marketing.

One of the things I like about Silicon Valley is that people are generally focused on creating value rather than making money. (The difference being that I can make money in ways that transfer money from your pocket to mine, without a net increase in value.) But my impression of Florida is that there's a different orientation there.

For example, South Florida is currently the identity theft capital of the US. [1] At least a few years back, a few Florida counties had more spammers than any other country. [2] It seems like the dubious business culture goes back to the scam-heavy Florida land boom in the 1920s. [3] That had an echo in Florida swampland scams in the 60s and 70s. [4] And Miami was one of the worst cities in the recent US property bubble. [5]

Do you notice that difference in business orientation and business ethics?

[1] http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2013-02-26/business/fl-iden...

[2] http://articles.sun-sentinel.com/2005-05-08/news/0505070596_...

[3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_land_boom_of_the_1920s

[4] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swampland_in_Florida

[5] http://us.spindices.com/indices/real-estate/sp-case-shiller-...

My general impression is that people in south Florida (in business) are looking for easy money. Not easy as in no work, but easy as in huge sums for minimal work. The homesteading act certainly attracts people from outside Florida who believe they could be sued for everything they've got. May be was a combination of the drug money in the 70s & 80s, along with the real estate boom more recently, but they don't seem very motivated.

A lot of the shadier companies I've been aware of have their offices, or at least mailing addresses, in Boca Raton. Others have agreed with me on this point. Especially in the internet advertising market you have all kinds of strange players.

I hear a lot of complaints about the ultra rich in NYC. If you have a $50 million apartment in Manhattan, when your walking down the street it doesn't matter. You enter a building, even if its an expensive one, who knows what your living in. If your being driven around in a Maybach no one cares. In South Florida, its more like LA, lots of wealth flaunting.

Before the real estate crash, these high end luxury condos were brand new and not cheap (well, still cheap compared to SF.) The boom basically created the infrastructure, subsidized by a bunch of greedy people, ironically. The reason some of these buildings still are cheap is because banks won't lend for them. (that is changing)

Hit the nail on the head. It's definitely a culture thing but I'm not sure how it surfaced. The disparity between SF and Miami becomes apparent when getting into a conversation with a stranger about general goals in life, motivation, and hobbies; it yields completely different results.

Fascinating. I didn't know that bit about homesteading. That explains quite a bit. And I had forgotten that the governor apparently made his money partly via a giant medicare fraud, which definitely says something about the business culture there.

And he still won the election. After spending several hunred million dollars. Of course, it's helped that his democrate opponent was a complete boob. But still.

His popularity is in the signal digits now too, of course. Luckily our governor really has little power. All the power rest in the legislature.

I lived in South Florida for 5 years, and have lived in the Bay Area since 1986, and you have described what I consider one of the essential differences between the two places. There was an article in a local business magazine or the business section of the paper when I was living in South Florida about the new CEO of the local power company (Florida Power and Light). The new CEO was quoted as saying that one of his mantras is, "The customer has my money in his pocket; how do I get it?" which was presented as a good mantra to have; and the CEO was presented as a man to be admired.

Being the (unofficial) world headquarters of a large industry that does more good than harm probably contributes greatly to making the Bay Area a good place for people like you and I to live (although it is good to remember that being the world headquarters of another such industry did not protect Detroit from becoming what I consider a very bad place to live).

P.S. your history should probably mention the time in the 1970s when South Florida was the cocaine-smuggling capital of the US.

"P.S. your history should probably mention the time in the 1970s when South Florida was the cocaine-smuggling capital of the US."

Isn't it still the cocaine-smuggling capital of the US? California and Texas picked up a lot of the marijuana routes when the center of gravity shifted from Colombian to Mexican cartels. But boat traffic from Haiti and other parts of the area is a huge cocaine route.

Anecdotally speaking: back when I worked in the entertainment business, I'd fly out to Miami for a lot of annual conferences. Maybe it's just the nature of that crowd, but man, they basically dusted the streets in coke. I could almost swear I got some as part of my check-in basket at the Fontainebleau.

I thought cocaine was everywhere in LA -- but in Miami I'm pretty sure you can buy it over the counter at a McDonald's, and no one would bat an eyelash.

Whoa. If you can find a source for that quote, I promise to use it forever as an illustration of what not to do. Great point on drug smuggling as well.

As a Michigander who has lived in SF a dozen years, the point about Detroit is especially interesting. Detroit lost out because they got complacent and exploitative. It allowed foreign competitors to come along and kick their asses in ways they couldn't even understand. (If you like This American Life, their episode NUMMI gives a very useful take on the cultural issue.)

I don't think we'll lose it that way, just because we self-define in ways that honor competition and user experience. But it's certainly possible. Google keeps growing, and Google Plus is a fine example of a dominant player getting fat and sassy and shifting toward exploitative behavior.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com