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Comment by jrockway | Hacker News Reader

It's the Republicans that want a small government and the Democrats that want a police state. It's just hard to remember that when all the non-crazy politicians are Democrats and the Republicans spend 90% of their time starting wars and arguing about whether it should be mandatory to say "under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance.

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Bullshit! Republicans like to forget, but the Bush Administration can't be so easily hidden. It was the Bush Administration that started the TSA, indefinite detentions at Guantanamo, the indefinite AUMF, the Yoo Torture Memos, the drone programs, the "Patriot Act" and NSA spying, not to mention other big government programs like "No Child Left Behind" and the unfunded Medicare Part D. Don't get me wrong; there are big, legitimate criticisms of the Obama Administration too, but don't let that "small government" rhetoric from the Republicans fool you. The GOP only wants small government when they're not in power.

The Bush Admin is worthy of just about any and all criticism one could muster. However, the domestic spying programs predate the Bush Administration. And it's worth noting, the Democrats have in no way been against the Patriot Act, in fact they've been very strongly in favor of it (which is why it wasn't killed during the super majority years).

For example, Carnivore came into existence under President Clinton:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnivore_%28software%29

And there has always been suspicion of domestic abuse of Echelon by the NSA (and that program obviously dates back many decades).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ECHELON

The only thing that began to change during the Bush years, is domestic spying came out into the open, with very little public resistance unfortunately.

Your note about the GOP is accurate, they abuse power when they're in control just like the Democrats do. For example, it could be similarly said that the Democrats are only in favor of protecting civil liberties when they're the minority party (ie when it's convenient).

The Republican Party and the Democratic Party (the national versions -- the RNC and DNC) are both in favor of big government and a police state. Big government accrues power, and even though the parties only get to time-share the government, a time-share of a big government lets them do more than they could with a time-share of a smaller government. Full fledged support of small government would be suicide; they simply talk it up when it helps them get elected. There's a lot of political machinery supporting the parties and the government at the size they are today. Reduce government, and some of that human machinery becomes unemployed. Some of those people who would be unemployed are the people setting party, and government, policy.

There are exceptions on both sides. Some Democrats have a philosophy that's sort of socially aware quasi-libertarianism (Senators from Oregon and Vermont come to mind). There are also libertarian-flavor "less-government" Republicans; Ron Paul being the canonical example. The Republican libertarians tend to go more for small government -- unless your social habits violate their social norms, in which case you're a criminal -- while the Democrat libertarians tend to go for medium government, but they are, or at least try to be, against a police state.

Ron Paul is a canonical example of a States' Rights politician, which isn't "less-government" at all. It's just taking more power for the state governments. The roots of this are not in Libertarianism but in the Confederacy.

And even so, Ron Paul isn't really liked by the rest of his party.

Democrats want a police state? That's an outrageous assertion that has no basis in reality what so ever. Keep your non-constructive partisan political comments to yourself.

I believe OP was ironic, quoting a cliche for both parties and then showing that repubblicans promote actions that have little to do with "small government" (i.e. wars and enforcing state wide religious positions), while saying that 90% of the democrats are sane.

Your misparsing of the comment is a good example why politically heated comments should be avoided in discussions like this.

Actually the republicans give lip service to small government but they are the ones who's actions indicate a desire for a police state (e.g. TSA, Patriot Act, etc.). Democrats are just a less extreme-right (but still right wing) version of the same thing.

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