Hacker News Reader

Comment by auctiontheory | Hacker News Reader

Mental illness is very common. This story has nothing to do with programming, except that technically strong people are given a lot of leeway for strange behavior, meaning that folks who need treatment often do not get it soon enough.

The other point, and I think by now all of us should know this, is that we are each responsible for our health and our careers - we cannot look forward to a lifetime with a paternalistic employer.

[Update: this was downvoted. I'm not at all harshing on programmers or on mentally ill people. But we need to face reality; doing otherwise serves no one.]

View on HN

Mental illness is certainly common, but someone who is normally able to cope ok can be pushed over the edge when under too much stress, and even who initially has no mental health problems at all can end up being driven to insanity, given the right conditions.

We need to be treating mental health just as importantly as physical health. There's all sorts of OH&S guidelines for proper posture, lifting things etc. Similarly, there should be OH&S guidelines for ensuring employees are provided with a safe working environment in which they're not going to end up like this (at least, to the extent that work contributed to their condition).

You definitely don't deserve to be downvoted. Mental illness is nothing to be ashamed about and needs to be treated seriously and head-on. Downvoting this is tantamount to stigmatization.

The worker described in the article is shockingly similar to someone I knew several years. That person had a psychotic breakdown at work and accosted our CEO (physically and verbally). He too worked long hours and was considered a productive employee. Though no one cracked the whip on him, I'm sure the stress was a trigger.

Luckily for him, he was in a good enough place to find help and take a step back to recover. Employees at my company kept in contact with him and talked with him frequently. Eventually he found another position and is thriving. I hope the worker in the article gets the same sort of support and isn't stigmatized by his actions.

I don't like labeling this type of situation mental illness. That suggests that it's only the individual who is ill. It seems to me that situations like this result from a sick system as much or more than from individual sickness.

Are you saying that the system is broken because some jobs ask you to be a hard worker?

The article indicated nothing specific that the company had done wrong. It even admitted that the guy was "well treated and well paid" for his hard work - he just didn't like how he was "respected".

It's astonishing me that getting paid and treated well to work hard triggers a comment that the "system is sick".

It's a matter of human beings being treated like cogs in a machine (which is in fact what they are in today's world). The potential of highly intelligent people is wasted by those who are better at extracting value than creating it. This leads to ever growing frustration which eventually explodes leading to the destruction of peoples lives.

These are seen as individual problems but if these trends continue I believe they will lead to the failure of human civilization and possibly of the human species itself.

hard worker - exactly the type of concept that the machine uses to exploit the naive.

human beings being treated like cogs in a machine

You realize that Hacker News is focused on people starting businesses, right? Why are you here?

hard worker - exactly the type of concept that the machine uses to exploit the naive.

When you get your car worked on, do you expect that the mechanic should fix your car because you're paying him to or because you give him a hug and tell him that he's a useful human being?

When you get a cup of coffee, do you expect the barista to want not only for you to pay for your double whip latte, but to also feel that you're validating her as a human being?

The guy was "well paid and well treated". Without an iota of evidence that the business was doing anything wrong besides expecting that its employees do a good job - you indite the system and ignore the probable fact that this guy had mental stability issues that were going to come out either at work, his personal life, wherever.

> When you get a cup of coffee, do you expect the barista to want not only for you to pay for your double whip latte, but to also feel that you're validating her as a human being?

Yes. I go out of my way to do so. I do try to find things to praise because these people have tons of negative interactions everyday. I do my best to make my interactions with them positive.

Why are you here ?

This is absolutely typical of the problem with society.

Judge me, exclude me, push me under a bridge.

It doesn't matter what you do to me, the day will come when man will be judged by those he has judged.

I'm not pushing you anywhere. Be here if you like. I was just trying to understand it.

Your comments here are about as appropriate as if I'd go to the golf course and go on melodramatically about how awful a sport golf is. At some point, people would ask me, "Why are you here if you don't like golf?"

No one's saying terrible circumstances don't exist. Mental illness is exasperated by terrible circumstances.

Exacerbated?

This comment really bugs me and I'm not sure why. Somehow I keep hearing in my head "I don't like labeling these gunshot wounds as 'injuries', what's really wrong is the environment full of random gunfire". It's the individual who is suffering, and that's important. Is illness supposed to be a cause, and not a result?

Thank you for pointing this out. Your downvotes are not deserved. I imagine a number of mentally healthly programmers looking to prove a point in regards to unscrupulous employers would prefer that this not be chalked up to mental illness.

Though the story to me reads like a classic case of mental illness and eventual breakdown. I posted a comment on the blog asking for follow up of the individuals case. Despite citing human factors I bet they don't know, nor care.

Off topic - but how does one downvote on HN? I only see a small up arrow to the left of the commenters' names. No down arrow.

There is a minimum karma threshold before new users are allowed to downvote.

Yes, ultimately each is responsible to himself/herself. But it doesn't help if someone higher up is taking advantage of such people, knowingly. It is nearly the same as taking advantage of people with low self esteem etc. The managers and higher ups needn't help, but at least they can stay away from making the situation worse.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com