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Comment by white_devil | Hacker News Reader

> Apples complete joke of a mobile operating system

How could you possibly think iOS is a "complete joke".. without being a raging GooGoo fanboy, that is?

There should be an equivalent of Godwin's law for the word fanboy and its derivatives. When I see it I immediately know rational conversation is over.

Then actually look up Godwin's law. It says something about the probability of a Nazi comparison occuring, but nothing about that loosing the argument or ending the conversation. And that's just as well, because why would it be otherwise? Because Godwin said so? What, is he Adolf Hitler or something?

The corollary to Godwin's law is that the first person to bring up the Nazis automatically loses the argument.

We need a new law that states whoever brings up Godwin's Law without Nazis being mentioned also loses the argument.

A law and a corollary are still two distinct things. What people like to claim Godwin's law says, it doesn't actually. And that one is just one of many corollaries (not "the corollary") many random people made up because they could, and which I reject because they have no basis in valid reasoning. After all, the only argument here is "someone said that". Why do people who believe nonsense on someone elses say-so object to Nazi comparisons? Well, well ^^

"The Nazis and the Soviets both used intimidation tactics to further their political power". Ohhh...it seems I have lost the argument. Horrible pity, really.

A fanboy is a fanboy. There's nothing wrong with pointing one out. Just be glad I didn't spell it "fanboi".

The post you replied to (with the "GooGoo Fanboy" term) was overly vociferous.

But that's when it's most important to avoid words like 'fanboy' because otherwise discussion dies. People probably thought you had a good point, but you lose that when you use words like 'googoo fanboy'. And that'll do nothing to sway the person you're replying to. If anything it'll just entrench them even more.

I didn't really think so. I thought GooGoo Fanboy was apt satire myself. The hyperbole of the original poster clearly showed that he/she was already very entrenched anyway.

And considering it's possible that debating someone's strongly held points with logical counter points will only irrationally strengthen the person's original beliefs anyway, I think humor was appropriate:

http://youarenotsosmart.com/2011/06/10/the-backfire-effect/

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/notrocketscience/2010/10/1...

Even if that's true, there are still many other HN readers watching the conversation who may be more open to logical arguments from either side.

So I think it's still "worth it" to respond in a meaningful way, even though you may not convince the original poster.

> But that's when it's most important to avoid words like 'fanboy' because otherwise discussion dies.

Any discussion with a raging fanboy is dead to begin with. He will reject anything that goes against his rose-tinted view of Google. Reason and logic won't reach him, and that's why it's alright to just call him a fanboy and move on, even though that's pointless too, of course.

In this case, I just wanted to point out the absurdity of calling iOS a "complete joke".

> And that'll do nothing to sway the person you're replying to. If anything it'll just entrench them even more.

That's alright. He's already plenty entrenched. He'll change his views when he has to.

How can you call that overly vociferous without thinking the same thing about "Apple's joke of an operating system"?

I was calling 'apple's joke of an OS' overly vociferous, not 'googoo fanboy'.

It adds to the noise, so, yes, there is something wrong with pointing it out.

Hello. I don't have any strong pro-Google feelings. I used to really like Apple.

iOS is only good for people that want something which works and which they don't need to spend any effort on maintaining. It is a complete joke for people that want a powerful mobile computing device.

I use an iPhone now but my next phone will be an Android. To be honest I'll probably continue to buy iPod Touches as long as they can be jailbroken, but that's the only way I can make iOS into a platform that I'm willing to use.

The last significant innovation in iOS was Notification Center. Android already had that, along with widgets, custom lock screens, custom keyboards...

> iOS is only good for people that want something which works

I believe that already disqualifies it from being a "complete joke", and the definition of a "powerful mobile computing device" might involve something else besides "being able to install whatever software you want to".

I spent two hours with my wife's iPhone trying to figure out which app was burning all her juice. On my android it takes just a few seconds since I can run a task manager that actually reports CPU utilization. From what I can tell, that is completely forbidden on iOS. Still, her phone does not "just work".

Mine seems to. Shrug There's always a counter-anecdote somewhere, I guess.

Back when the iPhone 4 was new, my friend had some kind of HTC Android, and he would beam about how he could run a tool that would help him micromanage battery power so that he could shut off this app versus that app (which he had to do quite often). I simply never had to. As Anandtech can back up, the iPhone 4 had amazing battery life compared to its contemporaries. Though more anecdotal evidence seems to show that newer iOS devices consume more power.

Anyway, for reference, Settings > Privacy > Location Services. You can see what is actively using GPS. As part of its low-power design efforts, other than music, there really isn't much else that the OS will allow to run in the background. All other closed apps are frozen in a saved state. Also, Settings > Privacy > Location Services > System Services, at the bottom, Status Bar Icon.

Yes iOS is for people who want to do something on their devices, android is for people who want to do something to their devices. Like a car owner who knows how to drive, but is not a mechanic and car owner who is a mechanic and spends days in the garage tweaking the engine instead of driving. Guess which one drives more. Maybe that explains disparity between the market share and web usage stats for iOS and Android.

The fact you can customize Android doesn't mean that you have to. The default Nexus OS is fine right out of the box, and generally reviewed as comparable to iOS. Just because you have the option to work on your car doesn't mean you have to.

To me, the vocal, diehard android fan is akin to the Fast and the Furious crowd so proud that they can modify their cheaper Hondas/Scions/Dodges to be as [insert adjective of choice] as a more expensive German luxury car. When really, nobody else cares. Neither the people who want a cheap reliable car nor the people in the luxury segment.

Personally, I drive a Honda. I like it. I work on it, and I could modify it, but as I get older and busier, I'm looking forward to getting something nicer that just works.

I will have to rethink my life plans of outfitting a Tesla Sports car with functioning Tesla Coils. Noone outside of me will care about it, and if it's not external respect, it ain't no respect at all. Having some fun (with dangerously high voltages)? Don't make me laugh.

I mean yes, if you don't enjoy the smell of coronal discharge and smoldering tank capacitors (They're both toxic smells by the way), and you just build one for show, you're not going to win anything. But if you're absolutely obsessed with modding/hacking/knitting/whatever, you don't care about winning anything, just the process of doing, as self-help-book-like that might sound.

>and if it's not external respect, it ain't no respect at all.

To be clear, that's your claim, not mine. Ultimately, people do what they like to do.

>Noone outside of me will care about it

This I could agree with, but sure, there'll be like-minded folks that will be interested. However, that's different from being smug and superior about your hobby.

>and if it's not external respect, it ain't no respect at all.

Yeah, but it was also sarcastic. I used to add //sarcasm tags, but they make you sound conceited.

>However, that's different from being smug and superior about your hobby.

I will be as smug and superior about my hobby as I want to //sarcasm.

But no, in all seriousness, having to act smug and superior about your hobby means you are trying to use it to garner social recognition/a feeling of superiority which you think will make you happy, which means your hobby doesn't allready intrinsically do that for you. An exception to that are hobbies intrinsically made for showing off, like golf or trophy wives.

///Last sentence is humorous and therfore not to be consumed straight out of the bottle. Dilute with 5cl literary figure appreciation for each cl, and consume within 3 days of opening.

What garbage. People buy phones to use them, period. Apple consumers are not special and more productive than other consumers.

Installing a new Android home launcher, setting up llama, etc on Android is NOTHING like trying to work through an automanual and make changes to your car. This analogy is utterly wrong..

I think you mean "people with mechanical aptitude" because the mechanics I know work on their own cars alot less than the car enthusiasts I know. And they certainly enjoy driving the cars they put so much time into a heck of alot more than the people who bring it into a mechanic to fix everything.

Perhaps the GP owns a windows phone :)

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