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Comment by jrockway | Hacker News Reader

You seem to be being sarcastic. But a guy did this inside his own house. Do you really think the government should come in and save him from himself? Why?

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The article didn't give a good description of the area around this guy's house... I, for one, would be concerned if I found out one of my neighbors had 3000 gallons of water in a poorly structured container in his garage. A collapse would most definitely affect me and my neighborhood. Aside from the inconveniences that would be caused, the neighborhood could very well end up stuck with the bill for repairing damage done to infrastructure (street, sewer, underground power lines, ...)

For what it's worth, I'd also be concerned if I found out my neighbor was: stockpiling firearms, making meth in his bathtub, keeping pet tigers, storing 3000 gallons of gasoline in a tank in his garage. I'm not trying to make a direct comparison, just hopefully illuminating the fact that it might not all be about the government "[saving] him from himself"

Aside from the inconveniences that would be caused, the neighborhood could very well end up stuck with the bill for repairing damage done to infrastructure (street, sewer, underground power lines, ...)

After criminal damage is done, the state can press charges. Everything else is a very slippery slope.

As an example, imagine your neighbor has a gas stove and accidentally leaves it on, unlit, all day. A pilot light turns on, and the house explodes, causing hundreds of thousands of dollars of damage.

Should the government ban gas stoves? How about electricity?

Finally, stockpiling firearms, making meth in the basement, keeping pet tigers, and storing 3000 gallons of highly-flammable liquid is not the same as having a small swimming pool. The things you list are generally illegal in all circumstances, but having a swimming pool is never illegal. Also, water just isn't that dangerous. The pool collapsing would probably not cause any more damage than watering a tree and forgetting you left the hose on.

So, as I mentioned earlier, you are heading down a very slippery slope. Individual rights should trump the possibility of "inconvenience" to your neighbors.

If anyone should be upset, it's this guy's insurance company.

Building codes exist for a reason, simple as that.

So... once somebody creates a code that makes it perfect and right and unquestionable?

I don't think the government should ban gas stoves, but I don't want my neighbor running his own gas lines that don't meet the building codes.

Can we agree that there is a grey area which covers where lines should be drawn in terms of personal rights vs. infringing the rights of others? It is certainly the crux of our system of government.

We obviously disagree where the line is in this particular case, and I totally respect your vigilance.

I do take issue with your statement "having a swimming pool is never illegal" -- that is certainly incorrect, at least by definition of the building codes in the jurisdiction I live in.

But I agree, we are surrounded by slippery slopes.

I seriously doubt 3,000 gallons of water in someone's garage poses any risk to the neighbors. It's not something I would want my upstairs neighbor to have, but he's in a house. Realistically it's probably .3-4" of water spread out over his property. Much less than a heavy rain storm. There's no way that would have an effect on the sewer or power systems. They just had a sewer line bust in my town and in 2 hours it leeched 460,000 gallons. It barely made the news and only did so because it had broken before and made a sewage geyser (sounds like Mike Rowe should help fix it). 3,000 gal is literally a drop in the bucket.

1, He empties it one day = the side walls now have the Earth pressure on the outside but nothing on the inside and so collapse inwards taking down you neighbors walls. Why do you think they put those big metal retaining walls down the side of excavations in the street?

2, It leaks and 250,000l of water flows out under the house washing away the soil that the foundations stand on. His neighbours house falls into the hole.

3, The houses were built on a concrete raft (common where the ground is unstable) he has just cut a big hole in the raft, it cracks and his nieghbours house falls over.

That's ignoring the risks from dumping that much water into the drainage system, leaking chemicals, humidity/damp etc.

What? Problems can happen sure, but lets not exaggerate.

1, I can't say for sure, but I think it's a free standing garage. Plus it was standing just fine without water pressure on it before he started. Plus water barely puts any pressure outward anyway (most of the pressure is right near the floor).

2, 3,000 gallons is 11,000l. So how is it going to leak 250,000l of water? I don't think any residential water meter could put out that much water in a week! And that for a full pressure leak. So totally bogus.

3, he specifically did not cut into the slab.

That much water? What much water? He's not dumping anything. And if it was a regular pool he would be doing exactly that, without you getting all worked up over it.

You want to explain problems with what he did - fine. But don't exaggerate, and make up non-existent problems.

Sorry I misread the article - from the picture I thought he had dug a hole in the foundations of a building for an underground pool. A surface pool (even inside a garage) is no more of a risk than a free standing pool in the garden. And the 25,000 was in lbs not kg.

... It's an above ground pool. The water would hit the concrete garage floor and go outside (and probably some of it going directly down the inside drain) down the driveway and into the gutter. But instead if it went into his yard it would be nothing more than a rain storm--no houses are washing away.

If the pool collapses with his kids in it, they might be killed. That plus the issue with damage to neighbors seems to provide a valid government interest to me.

How would they be killed? It's effectively a large hot tub sitting in his garage. No more dangerous either.

If it blew out the walls of the garage, then the roof would collapse. That doesn't bode well for anyone under the roof at that time.

yes because someone else coming over to the house may not realize that this is dangerous, craptastic, etc. dude may actually be setting himself up for a huge liability should this ever fail on an unsuspecting guest....his house insurance won't cover it, its non-permitted work

in any case he'll have to remove it if the house ever goes up for sale, there's no way that would pass inspection. the first thing an inspector will ask for is the permit for the work

AFIK he didn't modify the garage, so once it's time to sell all he has to do is drain it, disassemble it and no one will be the wiser.

House insurance doesn't necessarily extend to a free standing garage, so he might be cleared there too, he just has to hope nothing disastrous happens to it.

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