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Comment by sophacles | Hacker News Reader

Yeah, it's really gross that coffee cups are left all over the place. But yeah, rise in caffeine consumption in place of ethanol is thought to have enabled and fueled the enlightenment, and been a major factor in the industrial revolution.

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I meant the graffiti and needles in tunnels and under bridges etc.

I know what you meant. But the words you used apply to my reply too. It's a reminder that any attempt at an objective definition of "drugs" includes alcohol and caffeine, and that there is a huge cultural component to "good drugs" and "bad drugs". In fact, coffee was considered one of the bad drugs by many cultures it when first introduced to them - including European culture.

"If I couldn't, three times a day, be allowed to drink my little cup of coffee, in my anguish I will turn into a shriveled-up roast goat" https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schweigt_stille%2C_plaudert_ni...

Correlation and causation...

I think there might be multiple groups in play there

Look up how much the signatories of the constitutional convention drank the night before signing the constitution. Alcohol consumption remained massive during the 1800s by our standards, people just drank we more than we do and probably more than in the 1600s and 1700s because distilled alcohol became cheap and widespread while you only had access to beer and wine before that.

I believe in the US alcohol consumption peaked in the mid 19th century. It was common for alcohol to be provided on the job and for drinking breaks like coffee breaks.

Drinking culture changed more dramatically in English-speaking countries in late 1800s/early 1900s (temperance movement) than elsewhere.

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