Comment by quotemstr | Hacker News Reader

Comment by quotemstr | Hacker News Reader

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> Debate in private, come to a decision and move forward.

This norm is terrible. It's a chief reason California tech companies become dysfunctional. Debate spreads common knowledge and ensures ideas get tested before execution. Hiding discussions is selfish, antisocial behavior that prioritizes your social image over idea quality and everyone's benefit. If you're working for someone who can't tolerate debate, leave.

It's weak leadership indeed that feels like debate undermines authority. A recipe for hell is

1. eradicating formal levels and hierarchy so everyone is "equal" and "ideas win", then

2. establishing a norm that debate never occur in public so that "ideas win" doesn't actually threaten whatever tyranny-of-structurelessness primate power dynamics emerge.

Thoroughly poisonous culture. A strong leader welcomes debate because his authority is secure.

> If you're working for someone who can't tolerate debate, leave.

I dunno about you, but I've left a bunch of jobs (or been left) because I thought the people involved could handle debate, when they couldn't.

Your boss is a human, they have issues that may prevent them from accepting your (clearly better ;) ) solution, or they may have context that they can't share (their boss might be pushing for something dumb).

Ultimately, the hierarchy and the power differentials are real, and unless you're happy jumping ship all the time (which I am not, anymore) you need to find a way to deal with disagreements more productively (which often involves letting people save face by disagreeing in private).

> It's a chief reason California tech companies become dysfunctional.

I think the deeper reason for Cali tech dysfunction is the relentless norm of frankly insane positivity, not the ability for people to debate.

> relentless norm of frankly insane positivity, not the ability for people to debate.

They are aspects of the same thing.

Debate implies that things aren't already perfect. "Why would positive people argue", a Californoid might ask, "instead of working together to make something great?".

My chief problem with California tech is that it's structured to reward schmoozing at the expense of ideas themselves and marketed as the opposite. It's unreality.

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