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Comment by Aurornis | Hacker News Reader

I agree. I thought the electric motorcycle problem was overstated by people complaining online at first. Then they became popular around my house and I agree it’s a huge problem.

I’m fortunate enough to live around a lot of walking and mixed use trails for bikes and pedestrians. Recently they’re unsafe to use in the evenings because you have to be ready to jump out of the way of groups of kids (plus a few adults who should know better) going 45mph on electric bikes with throttles. They don’t even pretend to be e-bikes any more.

The big problem is that there is zero enforcement. If there was at least a chance that someone breaking these laws could lose their bike or have to pay thousands of dollars in fines I think we’d see a lot less of it. Right now everyone knows that they’re not going to get caught, so it’s a free for all.

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why is the throttle the issue and not just the 45MPH? would it be better with pedals and people peddling along in some only-would-ever-make-sense-on-an-ebike gear, but still going 45?

the problem is recklessnesss and speed, restrict and enforce those things, don't just let the bike makers shift the product 10% and re-create exactly the same issue, but "legally"

> why is the throttle the issue and not just the 45MPH?

The bikes with throttles are not legally e-bikes, so the products on the market ignore all of the other e-bike restrictions too. They have much more power and higher top speeds.

Even if they were fully limited, pedaling ensure more rider engagement and changes how people ride them. When you have to put some effort, however small, into moving the bike around you ride differently than if it's an effortless throttle input.

There are plenty of ebikes with throttles that have less power than ebikes without throttles. E.g. a lectric xpress 500 has 500 watts, there are some pedal assist only bikes with 750 or more watts.

It's power and speed that matters, as you point out, so make regulation built on that. Heck, arguably pedal assist is a throttle, it's just a different mechanism vs a twist handle.

I believe this to be growing pains. Legislation hasn't yet fully adapted, some of the legislation I've seen makes the mistake of conflaing these, and enforcement is nonexistent in most places. I suspect that as time passes, we'll find ways of allowing ebikes to flourish. Around me the biggest thing I've seen is parents on cargo bikes taking their kids, and that's a demographic that elected officials tend to listen to.

We have the laws. What they’re doing is illegal. I think they need a higher tier of penalties for the repeat offenders, but that would require anyone getting caught first.

It’s an enforcement problem.

The riders know they’re riding where police cars can’t get them. They also know that the bike cops aren’t allowed to ride ultra powerful electric motorcycles. They also know they can just drive off across some grass into a park if anyone tries to stop them.

It’s a hard problem.

> I suspect that as time passes, we'll find ways of allowing ebikes to flourish.

Electric bikes are flourishing here. Electric motorcycles on bike paths are the problem.

I think the electric term is confusing the issue. If it helps, imagine that these were just really quiet but powerful gas powered dirt bikes riding on the pedestrian path. That should give you an idea of what’s going on.

I know what you're talking about, but a lot of people are conflating them. In some cases it is legislators like a recent attempt to require ebikes have to register and have a drivers' license for them. In others it's parents not realizing that they got their kids an electric dirt bike instead of an ebike. Of course, you do have the antisocial element of people not caring and actually seeking out these, but we need to separate the different problems to address them, as you are doing.

> In some cases it is legislators like a recent attempt to require ebikes have to register and have a drivers' license for them.

Has any legislation been passed or was this only a proposal?

Crazy legislation gets proposed all the time with no possibility of passing. Some times no intent of passing, either.

I made a comment below about the law that just passed in New Jersey. The short of it is "Anything with two wheels and a motor is now legally a motorcycle, and must follow all the laws and regulations of motorcycles.

> We have the laws. What they’re doing is illegal. … It’s an enforcement problem.

Because some people think laws only ever exist to restrain as a show of power over others and something is only illegal if you get caught.

And some people just want to be contrarian and acting against the law is the ultimate punching-up.

Some laws are just a good idea, and provide benefit, or even just expectation/predictability, to everyone.

Japan puts these uturn fences up. The sign near the uturn part says "get off your bike and walk it"

https://pasteboard.co/IlXSlFUOgULW.png

I'm not sure how I feel about them. I like that the made a way to get you off your bike. I dislike that the path seems plenty wide enough to accomodate bikes and that it would be a useful bike path or 1/2 bike path, but they want it to 100% pedestrian path, even though it's not remotely crowded.

Motorcycle cops can ride faster than any e-bike, and go anywhere a bicycle can.

A car too, but you might kill the suspect [1]. Chasing kids on e-bikes down with motorcycles is asking for deathly accidents to happen.

[1] https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/en/2025/06/03/12-year-old-boy-dies...

That is not to be blamed on the cops. Let's try to be truthful.

Both sides are to be blamed, only one side are professional adults who are trained protect our community. A pursue is always dangerous, not only for the suspect but also for the cops and bystanders so it should not be done if not absolutely necessary.

Setting aside the question who is to be blamed, using motorcycles to pursue kids on bikes will cause the deaths of more kids. Is that a price worth paying? No.

This reaction is interesting to me. In many jurisdictions around the world, police are required to call off a chase if it is deemed unsafe for any reason.

In what world do you think it is OK for a 12-year-old boy riding an e-scooter to die after being chased by police? Before you respond: Ask yourself how you would react if it was your son (or close relative). Any parent would devasted.

I don't participate in clan mentality, where every tragedy has to be blamed on an outsider. An accident is tragic, it doesn't make it any less tragic that it was the kid's own fault. Or if you can't stand not having somebody else to blame, it's clearly the parent's fault.

Driving what's better described as an electric dirt bike with street tires through pedestrian paths is also asking for dead pedestrians?

As someone who has spent a lot of time riding both bicycles and motorized things, this is not true at all.

I could hop my bicycle over curbs that would bring a police motorcycle to a halt, or even toss a bike over a fence and then pick it up on the other side if I wanted. Or I could dip into the trees near the bike path where a police motorcycle has no chance of maneuvering.

Buy that time there cop is also on foot to chase you down.

This is not even remotely true.

Why are they illegal in the first place? Obviously people see value in such devices. They don't ride them for the sake of riding them without getting caught.

They have great utility, with their power, weight and size. They can be fast for sure, but it's also not on the same level as even a 300cc motorbike either - should they really be put into the same basket? How can that be enveloped by law - if it really has to be - without taking their utility away?

If the law is too restrictive, current users won't bother following, since the enforcement is so rare.

The discussion really depends on which country we're talking about, but basically speed bikes are not illegal. They're just considered as moped, meaning a 50cc motorbike and have to respect all the rules mopeds are subject to, such as:

- Having a license plate and back mirror

- Be insured

- Wear a helmet (not a bike helmet, a moped/motorcycle helmet)

- Drive on the road, not on bike lanes

Nobody is arguing they're equivalent to a 300cc motorbike.

again, you're confusing/conflating the definition of ebike. The problem is not a senior or disabled person using a pedal assist bike; it's electronic motorcycles being ridden like they're bicycles, by underage, inexperienced kids without protection. This is going to turn out much worse for everybody; look what New Jersey has done for ALL ebikes because of the lack of understanding that there is a big difference between a pedal-assist mountain bike and an electronic motorcycle.

>> Starting January 20, 2026, all e-bike riders in New Jersey need three things: a license, registration, and insurance. You have until July 19, 2026 to get these sorted out.

You might have replied to the wrong subthread.

in my area, one of the biggest groups using those vehicles were food delivery riders. for those guys, those electric mopeds were a gamechanger, as they were able to make many more runs that might have made the difference between "just enough" and "just not enough". now those are becoming illegal (on bike paths & without registration), but they're not making sense one the roads due to congestion. it's a lose-lose situation for the delivery riders and the people that order online, but a win for bicycle safety.

as far as i can tell most full time riders didn't switch to "pedal assisted e-bikes" but probably went looking for other work. we're back to students riding their private bicycles to make some money on the side.

Try speed bumps ?

Cyclists on track bikes going 30+ mph on mixed use trails are almost as bad.

You either ride responsibly or you're a selfish asshole. The vehicle doesn't matter as much.

Over here track bikes are not road legal and people who can legit hit 30 mph for any amount of time is maybe 1/1000. Any 12 year old kid that can convince their parents to buy them a $1000 Chinese e-bike can hit 30mph with no effort. In no way are sports cyclists as bad a problem.

The problem is the rider not the bike.

Easy for you to say. I’ve almost hit a couple stupid kids on an e-bikes with throttles riding on suburban roads at night with no lights.

And I’m seeing more and more fuckwits ride fast on side walks and accelerate to jump of the sidewalk and into traffic. Almost hitting unsuspecting people on the sidewalk.

Community needs to police itself. Otherwise it’s just going to be waiting for a critical mass of deaths.

>> a couple stupid kids on an e-bikes with throttles

I'm going to respond every time I see this: not ebikes; these are electronic motorcycles.

And this is from someone who thinks ebike are pretty stupid; justified for old and disabled people but only ever seen ridden by fat dentists.

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