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Comment by doktor2un | Hacker News Reader

I’d love to see the raw data.

Here's a raw table in .txt format from NASA

https://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs/graph_data/Global_...

That’s not the raw data. The original recordings were made by merchants on parchment. They measured the volume of water in a wooden box, to set the buoyancy for their loads

What are you even talking about. They had weather stations with mercury thermometers and wrote down temperatures in a logbook.

For the interested, here[1] is an article on an attempt to recreate and verify measurements made during the HMS Challenger expedition in the 1870s.

It was recently done so the full results aren't out, but one aspect they noted was that the traditionally-created hemp rope stretched about 10% so temperatures were taken at slightly deeper depths than expected. This can be used to calibrate the data from HMS Challenger.

[1]: https://www.oneoceanexpedition.com/article/checked-150-year-...

I appreciated your comment because more discussion will better help everyone understand the various tranches of surface temperature observations.

I did a quick review, and appreciated the article because they were clear about how their methods different from the recordings. For one using different pressure sensors, and they mentioned the depth differential they measured would lead to variability in the ocean temp readings.

Not on the ocean, and not covering even 1/1000% of the coverage we have with satellites on the surface

There are tons of raw data available freely and publicly. In my estimation, there is no comparable scientific discipline with a better curated data environment.

What exact raw data would you want? I am sure ChatGPT can throw together some python that will download the relevant data.

https://cds.climate.copernicus.eu/datasets

You are capable of operating Google, right?

And what will you do with the raw data? Are you trained in processing and interpreting it? How good is your math?

Climate deniers are perfectly trained for finding some weak spots in any data anytime they want. It would be better for them to be trained enough to show at least any links to any studies though. It is so hard to convince a climate denier to give at least one climate-denying source for the sake of experiencing some laugher together.

you're right this is much to complicated and important for anyone to understand. just take our word for it that we have to make things more expensive, raise taxes, and restrict freedoms to fix it.

Right, if only scientists who understood it would publish some sort of document explaining their methods and citing the raw sources.

> we have to make things more expensive, raise taxes, and restrict freedoms to fix it

Aha, right on cue the mask slips off. Desperately trying to justify your own selfishness in the name of "freedom".

If you are serious about this, you know full well the data is out there. So stop asking for it and just go get it, go write some code and process it, then come back here and report your results.

i went and got the raw data, wrote some code to parse it and then process it, and my results:

MMTS locations are so close to heat sources and heat sinks, at least in the US, that any sort of debiasing appears to be a "guess."

statistically. 96% of them. thankfully NWS/NOAA/NASA/etc have started deploying wireless sensors, but unless they admonish the volunteers for placing their (NWS/NOAA/etc) dumb MMTS designs so close to heat sinks and sources, as if it was their fault, demanding that volunteers move the sensors to a location 20 meters from said sinks and sources...

you're just gunna have and continue to have decades of literally unusable data. But hey, hottest year on record!

I am not mad at volunteers. it isn't their fault the MMTS devices only came with 10 meters or whatever of cabling for the indoor-outdoor data. I would, however, like to see the rationale and meeting notes and design documents (and the reasoning and arguments thereof) for the MMTS; explicitly for use tracking climate trends.

anecdote: i have multi channel humidity and temp sensors that log to SD card. they have been logging for a long time. My outdoor sensors, as well as our cars, etc, show that our location is always 7F cooler than the nearby metro (20 miles) during the warm months. If we used my temperature data, i'd believe the trends. if we use the temperature data from the sensors they use at the airport, it's going to show warming - and i submit you can't de-bias that using the methods used for the IPCC and other reports. and when i say 7F cooler here than there, i mean on the thermometers on our cars (and multimeters, or even a liquid-in-glass carried around!). I also mean my location is consistently cooler than the forecast temperatures for the city.

i understand weather is not climate.

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