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Comment by rayiner | Hacker News Reader

True. But it’s also disingenuous to ignore the massive institutional momentum in favor of unrestricted trade? Throwing debris on the track may have been the only way to stop the train that was rolling on its own towards zero tariffs.

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Zero tariffs are good! That's why the US put "no internal tariffs between states" in the constitution!

They’re good as long as everyone is co-operating and has a common idea of ‘good’.

Notably, China, India, etc. still tax the every loving crap out of most imports in their jurisdiction (yes, tariffs!).

I suppose by mimicking them we hope to bring the US to the standard of living that the Chinese and Indians have.

Not sure if you've been to China lately, but their standard of living has improved dramatically over the past 25 years (after they began restricting and penalizing imports). The quality of their domestically-built consumer products now exceeds what's available in the US, and costs less. This is what happens when you stop outsourcing and bring manufacturing on-shore. The opposite has happened to the US over the same period, where international corporations (such as GE, GM, etc.) shut down on-shore manufacturing and import everything. In addition to the immediate economic effects, the long term effect is that the US has lost its ability to participate (let alone compete) in many manufacturing areas.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_China_(194...

I haven’t been recently. I was in Hong Kong last just before the pandemic and my parents have been to China recently. It’s quite an advanced place but they happily prefer the US to China still.

I have a friend I met last year who lives in China and he’s looking to move to Singapore. So I’m not super informed but also I think I have enough anecdotal knowledge that someone showing me a GDP chart won’t convince me life is better there.

But we may go in a few months after we take our daughter to her ancestral Taiwan. Then I’ll see for myself.

Many Indians told me India is rapidly approaching the West once and I went there for a friend’s wedding and they were right but in the sense that Andromeda is approaching us at 120 km/s: it’s fast but the gap is big in standard of living.

So I’m a bit hesitant to believe this stuff. I’ll see for myself.

I think that’s more a side effect of China being the worlds manufacturing hub - which has nothing to do with their import policies, and everything to do with their export/currency policies.

There isn’t much ‘made in the USA (actually)’ at this point.

Plenty of other places have similar import policies - and still import most things from China. Like India, and well, frankly most of the world at this point.

Well, someone very well might - it’s not the common man though.

Notably, those in power in both countries live pretty cushy lives.

I think this is an excellent point. Let's say they had NOT done that (and thank goodness they did) - would the current defenders of tarrifs see this as a path to wealth between states too? Me thinks they would. But they why stop there. Why not impose such tarrifs between cities. And if that enriches cities - neighbors should get in on the action too, no?

There is a modern Bastiat style essay waiting to be written here.

The founders' notion of free trade between states created an economic "race to the bottom" that has been hurting northern states for decades now as business moves to lower-tax and lower-regulation southern states. It would be hugely beneficial to Illinois or New York if they could tariff cheap goods from Georgia or Alabama.

"guys actually taxes are good and we should have more trade barriers!!"

War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength.

I don't know why you can't just admit you're out of your depth here instead of doubling down on the dumbest and most chaotic trade policy we've ever seen.

Doubling down when you're out of your depth is the MAGA way.

Trump is using effectively unrestricted powers to impose tarriffs, there is no institional momentum in his way. He did not need to 'throw debris' anywhere.

Further, when he's out of office, I fully expect all his tariffs to evaporate. All we have to do is bide our time.

Trust takes a lifetime to build but just a moment to lose. The rest of of the world is not going to risk the deep dependency vassal state relationship that it had with the USA. Things don't reset like that.

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