Comment by bob1029 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by bob1029 | Hacker News Reader

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I am starting to see the benefits to secure boot and TPM from a gaming perspective. I realize this can still be tampered with but it eliminates so many casual cheaters that the edge case is practically irrelevant.

I don't see how my TPM module will prevent me from using the machine the way I want. The offer of a cryptographic assurance to a 3rd party is something I happily provide in order to gain access to a competitive gaming resource. Cheaters really fucking suck and if this is what it takes to ruin their day, then fantastic. I'm looking forward to TPM3.0 now after seeing how ruinous this has been to their schemes. These tools are effective.

Battlefield 6 is especially problematic for malcontents because its developers also enjoy using statistical methods to detect cheaters. TPM2.0 + statistical methods + $69.99 per try = probably can't afford to play this game unfairly for very long. Even if you can afford it, the in game progression takes an eternity. You're gonna need that 8x scope if you want your "undetectable" frame scanning aimbot to be of any use.

> I don't see how my TPM module will prevent me from using the machine the way I want.

I guess people don't know this particular dystopia is implemented.

First a platform gets third parties (games, banks, etc.) to impose their attestation system on customers. Congrats, you're locked in! This is the gun they point at you but the bullet comes after.

Now you can't leave the platform or you lose all your games, have to get a new bank, etc. The more stuff they can get to require that, the more stuck you are. This also prevents any new competitors from building a network effect. But competition -- the ability to switch to a competitor -- is the only thing stopping them from being the worst people in the world. Ads in the start menu. Censoring whatever they don't like. If you want to buy something -- anything -- they want a 30% cut. They'll hide it from you but take it anyway. All your local files get uploaded to their cloud and the terms let them use it for AI training, or whatever else they want. And soon you have to pay a monthly fee if you don't want them to be deleted. Why would not paying also delete them from your local machine? Because screw you, you don't have a choice anymore.

> I don't see how my TPM module will prevent me from using the machine the way I want.

"Your version of TPM is unsupported. Please update your hardware to enjoy playing Battlefield 7". Your 69.99 per try just went up to 769.99 _for legitimate users_ because you need a new CPU with updated TPM for every new version. I'm being hyperbolic, but only slightly.

If you want a real example of this, Windows 11 requires TPM 2.0 to run. Hardware predating wide TPM2 adoption can be powerful enough to run Windows 11, except the company decided you need a new computer to do that.

> I am starting to see the benefits to secure boot and TPM from a gaming perspective. I realize this can still be tampered with but it eliminates so many casual cheaters that the edge case is practically irrelevant.

This is overkill for a feature that is only relevant to one specific usage of PCs. Imagine if your PC got crippled because farmer IT admin benefits from it

I don't think it helps for cheaters, you have cheaters on console and it's even more locked down than that.

Not to mention hardware based cheating that just implements a fully compliant USB mouse, keyboard, and HDMI setup, and DMA like https://www.dma-cheats.com/

I'm sure some jackass is going to suggest cryptographically verifying that you are using peripherals from trusted manufacturers soon.

That's physically not possible though, you could always have a device which pushes through the buttons on a genuine controller.

Of course, but the analog hole never stopped DRM aficionados from trying either. Who cares if the "solution" mainly ends up hurting legitimate users.

Entertainment is the last thing you should give up your freedoms for.

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