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Comment by iaw | Hacker News Reader

I know this wont go over well but I think it's important to remember: Steve Jobs did not treat his pancreatic cancer when he was first diagnosed and it was treatable, he instead sought holistic/alternative medicine treatments[1]. He leveraged his vast wealth to get a replacement liver [2] that at the time was known to only extend his life. That liver could have gone to someone that did not have such a negative prognosis and possibly saved their life for a lot longer than it did Steve. He used a chunk of his remaining time to work on his last yacht.

He was a great product person but I don't think that excuses all of the horrible things he did as a human.

[1] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/food-for-thought/201...

[2] https://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/24/liver.transplant.prior...

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> Steve Jobs did not treat his pancreatic cancer when he was first diagnosed and it was treatable

That's his choice, it's _his_ cancer after all

> I don't think that excuses all of the horrible things he did as a human

I think this is a bit of a leap. He's done some bad things sure, but the only ones you mentioned were...working on a yacht, using alternative medicine and getting a liver transplant

> That's his choice, it's _his_ cancer after all

While you're right, freedom of choice implies acceptance of risk and consequence. Leveraging wealth to jump the line, and presumably taking a liver from someone who could have used it, seems like the opposite of that.

A similar example from recent years is those who rejected all medical advise regarding COVID, and were still entitled to a hospital bed and respirator when it didn't work out for them.

> That's his choice, it's _his_ cancer after all

Stripped away some other people's choice, though.

I somewhat agree, but I'll say that cancer can move fast and it's important to keep that context in mind.

Jobs delayed for 9 months before doing traditional treatments. I don't believe he ever did full chemo.

Jobs getting the liver was more an exposure of a weakness of the transplant system in general. [1] Transplants are region locked. We can't easily move a liver across the country which means that it can be use it or lose it. Jobs had the resources to get put on lists across the country and had the resources to get to any part of the country from where ever he was in under 3 hours thanks to his private jet.

I don't think there's really a practical way to solve this problem. The want is national list for people that need new livers and some sort of life flight system to get the liver to the person in need.

I guess the one way to make it more fair would be coordinating the lists and tracking/penalizing someone for being registered across the nation. But if the list has Jobs on it the next person in line is also someone with cancer I don't really see a reason why Jobs couldn't get the liver.

[1] https://www.cnn.com/2009/HEALTH/06/24/liver.transplant.prior...

Here is a good podcast on his terribleness: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aEv08Zzunfc Some high points: Incredibly abusive to his employees, stole from Woz, screwed over his employees when Apple went public and Woz covered, refused to admit his daughter Lisa was his for many years. The man had great taste but the way he is worshipped in Silicon Valley is off-putting. Woz is a much better person to wish to emulate in my opinion.

I don’t know what Steve was thinking, but the desire to try alternatives is not necessarily just woo based thinking. Chemo and surgery are not just a walk in the park. I’ve seen people do chemo and surgery and then just die anyways, having basically tortured themselves with chemo and surgery before death. Cancer sucks and there are sometimes no great answers. I have a really low opinion of grifters that falsely advertise that they can definitively cure cancer with alternative medicine, but I respect any individual’s choice to take the path they are most comfortable with with their own body.

The pancreas is also one of the "it bleeds like crazy" organs which makes it hard to operate on. It's a much higher risk vs cutting off a mole for skin cancer.

I agree, even though he was way off on his thinking at least he tried something. The doctors told my father to go ion chemo because it would give him 2 yeras vs the 1 year he was facing with his pancreatic cancer. My sister, a oncology nurse told him not to do it, but he id. The chemo ended up causing a bile duct blockage which killing him after six months.

It is because of what Jobs did we know what not to do.

Which of the things you listed do you believe are "horrible things he did as a human"?

By all accounts, he fought tooth-and-nail to avoid recognizing his own daughter even after a state ordered paternity test [1]. There's quite a bit of evidence that whatever his positives as a product manager, he was a singularly unpleasant individual.

[1] https://finance.yahoo.com/news/steve-jobs-denied-daughter-ye...

Jobs' relationship with his family was famously strained.

The whole buying a liver thing?! Do you have any idea what the process is to get a liver, even if you are dying of liver failure? I liked Steve until that point.

He didn’t buy a liver, he registered in Tennessee which has low waiting times.

Was it some sort of black market exchange?

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