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Comment by nvmc | Hacker News Reader

There is plenty of excellent content (consequently, statistics), you just have to look a little harder. I would hazard a guess that you've taken a quick glance and dismissed the entire community. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

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Let me know when, say, /tg/ stops casually tossing around f-g and f-ggot while pretending that's not at all homophobic.

Garbage dump is entirely appropriate. I have no idea how anyone older than 20 can tolerate 4chan.

While you're talking about the homophobia, let's not ignore the blatant racism on 4chan. The work n-gger is not only casually thrown around on those boards, at this point it's ingrained racism that's influencing a lot of young teens visiting the site and is subtly encouraged by the moderators. It's disgusting and even thought I'm a strong advocate for the freedom of speech, I fear the power of effective propaganda.

You do know that 4chan has a pretty large gay population right? In fact I would say roughly 70% of that site's viewers are bisexual.

Just a little bit of confirmation bias there, from my own experience. That notwithstanding, 4chan most definitely has a higher rate of homosexuals than the rest of the internet.

While you clearly pulled that percentage out of nowhere I would agree it's probably not too far off. While it's fair to call it bisexuality, it might be more accurate to simply label it sexual opportunism.

If you really think the use of fag and faggot reflects homophobia, you need to take a step back and look at where you are - the internet. Do you think that people posting gore do it because they enjoy the content? It's all shock value.

(Not really interested in whether 4chan's use of "fag" reflects homophobia. I am responding to your next sentence.)

>Do you think that people posting gore do it because they enjoy the content?

I think there are those who post gore because they get pleasure from grossing people out, outraging people or otherwise eliciting a strong emotional reaction (which is probably what you mean by "shock value") but I do not think that is all of it.

I think a significant fraction of the people posting gore do it because it will induce others to post gory pictures that the OP has not seen yet. And I think that they want that because they derive pleasure from seeing people and animals being harmed.

One of the reason I believe that is a book I read called Among the Thugs, in which a reporter spent some time hanging out with British football hooligans. He reported that after running with the hooligans a while, engaging in violence and contemplating engaging in violence became pleasurable. This and other things suggest to me that many people are capable of deriving pleasure from seeing people get fucked up once they've acquired a taste for it.

The main reservation I have about 4chan is that it seems to be enabling many to acquire a taste for it (and for other things like harassing people on Facebook).

At least when I still browsed /b/, gore was almost entirely to dissuade people from browsing. The logic being that if you couldn't get over it, you weren't all that welcome.

So explain somethingawful.com and the many other sites dedicated to the posting of gore and gruesome deaths?

I don't think you know what SA is. You going on the domain name alone?

> If you really think the use of fag and faggot reflects homophobia, [...]

Yes, it does.

> you need to take a step back and look at where you are - the internet. Well...

I suggest reading this introduction to the subject of "why second degree&ironic gay bashing work only if there is real homophobia somewhere": http://www.queerty.com/does-calling-someone-a-fag-really-mea... I have better articles about sexism and homophobia but there are written in french.

People really like to dismiss that by calling it transgressive humor, but it's really not? You never truly get made fun of for being part of the majority.

Normalizing the "ironic" use of slurs normalizes the unironic use of them as well, and further entrenches privilege as a norm.

It doesn't take spending a lot of time in any nerd culture group to see that the racism, sexism, and homophobia are not ironic at all. Case in point, the enormous administrator/moderator-led backlash on SA in the past ~year against anyone daring to not openly welcome the death of anyone who is not a white cis male.

fag and faggot doesn't mean “homosexual” in 4chanspeak.

However, it does mean that people like you don't go there, so it's a pretty good thing that they have that slang.

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