Comment by socalgal2 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by socalgal2 | Hacker News Reader

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I don't know how to state this well but I find the fact that nearly all new apartment buildings in California are only allowed to be built on busy streets very frustrating. I'm guessing it's part nimby-ism and part zoning but every time I see a new apartment complex it's next to the busiest streets in the city (LA, SF). It's like many things, if you want health you must be rich. If you can't afford a house then F.U. You get a loud apartment with constant traffic noise.

I *almost* feel like it should be illegal to build them next to the freeway like

Those ones just north of SFO next to the 110: https://maps.app.goo.gl/sAkUMhmnutZ1jFd27

The ones in downtown LA next to the 110: https://maps.app.goo.gl/4mBVLo12hLR4EwU16

The ones north of LAX at Howard Hughes: https://maps.app.goo.gl/Z8bnB7wR5jDBddhg6

I don't actually think I think they should be illegal but dang it, I wish there were more options for new apartments. In LA there are lots of older apartment buildings in quiet residential neighborhoods built 50+ years ago.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/KMLav1zLiQZK6T8L6

https://maps.app.goo.gl/aUH52rBAbaHExjzB6

They are no longer allowed to be built AFAICT.

> only allowed to be built on busy streets

Is this true or a misleading observation?

I can see some argument about it, increasing traffic in areas that aren't equipped for it if the building is large enough. But it might just be market forces, too: in larger cities, it's often more desirable to be near a major artery. Earplugs (if the noise bothers you) vs a longer commute.

It is quite literally illegal to build anything but detached single family homes on 95.8 percent of the total residential land area in California / 75% of the residential land area in most major American cities.

"Residential land area"? Much of California's land has no zoning at all. Of course, it's not near any cities either (or near any road noise).

It is illegal to build housing without a permit, and you will not be issued a permit on much of California’s land.

Residential land area = land you can build housing on

https://belonging.berkeley.edu/single-family-zoning-californ...

Daily reminder that our zoning policy is deeply racist and evil

I don’t know about “only allowed”, but this is a thing:

https://sd11.senate.ca.gov/news/senate-passes-senator-wiener...

That's not a problem with the location. That's a problem with building materials. I've lives on the busiest street in town, with well insulated walls and windows that block out street noise. And I've lived in poorly -constructed suburban houses that admit noise from across the neighborhood.

I disagree. The location is definitely a factor. If you live within 300 feet (about 100 meters) of a multi-lane highway, then depending on the wind patterns, you are definitely getting more exposure to pollutants that come from cars, trucks, or their brakes and tires. But no one in California is ready to talk about addressing this because it would require radically changing the status quo.

So you’re saying people living in apartments are required to never open their windows?

I’m all for better construction but I still want to be able to open my windows without having to let in tons of noise and car exhaust

Check out the location of these condos in downtown Toronto built alongside the Gardiner Expressway, a very busy 90km/h (~55mph) highway: https://maps.app.goo.gl/TGLCBJGbrSEkAm7W6

The satellite view shows many units in multiple buildings directly next to this highway with no noise protection: https://maps.app.goo.gl/JA4jMPSSYsDBq5my5

Years ago I lived near a busy four-lane road with what seemed like a reasonable 60km/h speed limit. However, when it rained, the noise from the car tires on the wet road made it difficult to hear music from my radio. It was very unpleasant to leave the balcony doors open, as the constant din starts to work its way into your brain and make it very difficult to focus.

https://cayimby.org/legislation/sb-79/

They will be allowed by right near any type of transit stop if SB79 goes through!

This entrenches that behavior because the transit stops are often on arterials.

Hopefully the legislators have thought of this and extended the downzoning to half a mile even for BRT stops in the middle of the sunset district :)

Streets are much quieter at lower speed limits. There is definitely room for improvement here from the traffic engineers.

To a point. The problem is that the kind of people who are always screeching about traffic speeds are never satisfied and below a certain threshold the only way to go get slower is 4-way stops. And once those go in you get to listen to every motorcycle and delivery truck accelerate after the stop.

Downtown is very low speed but very noisy.

Say what you will about the suburbs but the grass and landscaping on each and every property is like noise cancelling foam being applied compared to the hardscaping downtown.

This is why I moved to suburbs tbh

Compared to the city it's so quiet and peaceful. My sleep is much better

I was looking for an apartment on the SF Peninsula a couple years back. Nearly all apartment buildings constructed in recent years are right next to the freeway or right next to the CalTrain train tracks. Lots of air and noise pollution, and it feels like borderline hostility towards renters. Lived there for a short while and ultimately moved out of the Bay Area because of the poor options for renters in that area (although it gets better the further south you go) and of course the sky-high housing prices.

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