Hacker News Reader

People have short memories. In the early months of 2020, the CDC and WHO both recommended not wearing masks, for good reason. Decades of research had shown cloth masks were completely ineffective, and N95 masks were only effective if fitted professionally, and those should be reserved for health workers anyway. People who started buying up masks in early 2020 were accused of hoarding and possible price gouging.

Then the CDC changed its stance due to pressure from politicians who wanted to be seen as Doing Something, and we got the mask mandates starting in May. Masking took over as the most visible symbol of being a goodthinker, to the point that other efforts like social distancing and hand-washing were largely forgotten. I remember mask-wearers constantly going against the arrows in the aisles of the grocery stores, apparently thinking their loose cloth masks protected themselves and others around them so well that they could ignore all the other rules.

It was an incredibly stupid time, and a lot of the stupidity came from the top, from talking heads like Fauci who flipped overnight on questions like that and expected everyone not to notice.

1950 - "smoking reduces stress and improves longevity"

1970 - "smoking is harmful"

Checkmate, scientists!

In all seriousness, we don't need a vast conspiracy for this. It's called being wrong and changing your mind, we do it all the fucking time.

Nobody expects what people said about Tuberculosis in 1920 to be 100% accurate today. But for some reason, people expect what was said about Covid in the beginning to ALWAYS be accurate. Why would that be the case? It's a novel disease. Yeah duh our understanding is going to change.

You're comparing decades of science that results in different conclusions, to a 13 day period?

And don't you think it's smart to not make definitive statements if you don't really know?

This is all basic public relations 101.

Yes, because within a 13 day period of course your understanding can change.

I agree their PR could have been a little better. But, it was also not that bad all things considered. The thing is conspiracy theorists would've rejected any vaccine, and there's nothing anybody could have done about that. Ultimately the CDC can't make stupid people unstupid.

    > LaPook, March 8: There’s a lot of confusion among people, and misinformation, surrounding face masks. Can you discuss that?

    > Fauci: The masks are important for someone who’s infected to prevent them from infecting someone else… Right now in the United States, people should not be walking around with masks.

    > LaPook: You’re sure of it? Because people are listening really closely to this.

    > Fauci: …There’s no reason to be walking around with a mask. When you’re in the middle of an outbreak, wearing a mask might make people feel a little bit better and it might even block a droplet, but it’s not providing the perfect protection that people think that it is. And, often, there are unintended consequences — people keep fiddling with the mask and they keep touching their face.

    > LaPook: And can you get some schmutz, sort of staying inside there?

    > Fauci: Of course, of course. But, when you think masks, you should think of health care providers needing them and people who are ill. The people who, when you look at the films of foreign countries and you see 85% of the people wearing masks — that’s fine, that’s fine. I’m not against it. If you want to do it, that’s fine.

    > LaPook: But it can lead to a shortage of masks?

    > Fauci: Exactly, that’s the point. It could lead to a shortage of masks for the people who really need it.

Its not waving hands.

Im really curious why you hold that opinion though. Do you not care that much about what the actual truth is? Like do you hear/read about how Fauci said opposing things supposedly, and just don't care enough to check the facts? Or is there another reason why you believe he is contradicting himself.

How you can read even just this conversation and walk away without thinking Fauci is at best terrible at public health communications, at worst guilty of flip flopping is beyond me.

Even in this one conversation - "The masks are important for someone who’s infected to prevent them from infecting someone else…" to "And, often, there are unintended consequences — people keep fiddling with the mask and they keep touching their face." to "I’m not against it. If you want to do it, that’s fine." to "It could lead to a shortage of masks for the people who really need it."

Just in this one interview it goes from "if you're healthy you don't need one" to "masks can actually make things worse" to "if you want to do it, it's fine" to "don't do it, it could lead to a shortage".

Then a month or two later, he's supporting strict mask mandates even for healthy people.

If there is another health crisis, this guy should never be allowed to talk to the media ever again.

Ah got it.

Given the text of the conversation, which happened early on, and things were unknown, its pretty easy to see the rhetoric is Fauci highlighting the possibility of shortage for masks for the medical staff given that in public they may not be that effective. Then later on, when there were enough masks for everyone and more studies came out, the recommendation was to wear masks.

And of course, masking, social distancing, quarantine, and vaccine were all proven to work post-hoc through studies overwhelmingly. So the big bad government was right all along.

The interesting thing is that you a) ignore his first sentence which clearly states his intent to prioritize medical professionals, and b) conflate his caution against shortages with him telling people to mask up.

The 2 explanations of why you think like this is either you are incapable of reading comprehension, or you are so ideologically driven that you basically make up reality in your head real time that fits your world view. And either reason is why conservatives should no longer be tolerated - because its not about my view vs yours, its about actual reality vs your insanity.

> The 2 explanations of why you think like this is either you are incapable of reading comprehension, or you are so ideologically driven that you basically make up reality in your head real time that fits your world view. And either reason is why conservatives should no longer be tolerated - because its not about my view vs yours, its about actual reality vs your insanity.

Did you not read the same thing I read? He held 4 different positions in the same interview - healthy people shouldn't wear masks, then masks actually make things worse, to "I don't care if you wear them", to "healthy people wearing them causes shortages".

Then add on top later on he demanded oppressive mask mandates for everyone.

You call that a public health care expert?

And that's not even getting into his political answers about the Wuhan lab and his involvement.

The guy is a terrible, terrible public health leader, yet because he's Team Blue(tm) you give it all a pass.

Its really fascinating how your brain works.

Again, you either lack basic comprehension of written text, unable to imagine the conversation taking place with a context in mind, and understand that just because the message wasn't communicated the way you would have preferred doesn't mean the message is wrong or contradictory.

Or you understand all that, but you have intimately tied your ideological beliefs into your identity to the point where admitting you are wrong is basically saying to yourself that you are shell of a person.

One last question: suppose we took random people off the street, and then gave them that transcript and asked them to interpret what Fauci was saying, and the vast majority of them agreed that nothing in that message was contradictory - would you change your mind? Or would you think that you are more "enlightened" than all of them?

> Again, you either lack basic comprehension of written text, unable to imagine the conversation taking place with a context in mind, and understand that just because the message wasn't communicated the way you would have preferred doesn't mean the message is wrong or contradictory.

I find it hilarious how you try and gaslight me, when even the left-wing media admits Fauci and the CDC lied on several occasions and issued contradictory statements.

https://slate.com/technology/2021/07/noble-lies-covid-fauci-...

"One thing is beyond a doubt, however: One of those two statements did not accurately reflect the evidence as Fauci saw it. Such high-profile mixed messages in a short time frame, without substantive new data to justify the change, generated confusion and a backlash from politicians, other experts, and the general public."

Maybe it's your own "ideological beliefs" that stop you from seeing something everyone else sees?

Just like to point out that as expected, you can't answer the question.

There isn't much point in answering your question when you're denying something everyone already agrees happened.