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Comment by bethekidyouwant | Hacker News Reader

“Ketones, whether produced endogenously through fasting or low-carbohydrate/high-fat diets or administered exogenously as a supplement, have been shown to improve age-related cognitive decline (23–25) and to restore insulin-resistance-induced deficits in axonal conduction velocity” - Another win for the gym bros

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As someone who has been weight lifting for the past few years and previously was really into keto diets, one thing I've realised is that carbs are simply necessary in order to have the energy to push very heavy weights. Fat just doesn't give you the required energy to do so.

With that said, if you're only pushing moderately heavy weights or if you're a beginner and you're starting out with low weights, then it usually can be done.

Though the compromise is usually to eat high carb/low fat on workout days, and low carb/high fat on rest days. Fasting as well helps a ton.

Carbs are extremely helpful for strength, but there's a middle ground between ketosis and the standard American diet.

Most who lift and do low carb time their carbs before and after workouts for specifically this reason. Some also do carbs before bed.

But the rest of the day is close to no carbs. This still works. You can get < 100g of carbs a day and not have strength and energy negative impacts.

> Most who lift and do low carb time their carbs before and after workouts for specifically this reason. Some also do carbs before bed.

This is exactly what I do. I have a have a pre-workout carb meal to try and compensate.

Though one interesting thing I've noticed is that I've intentionally had to eat carbs as my body fat percentage has decreased. Otherwise I feel very low energy (though to be fair, I think part of it is that I'm still very active on my rest days, usually doing 20 - 30k steps). I think with higher body fat my body could simply burn that fat for energy, whereas that surplus simply isn't there.

> I think with higher body fat my body could simply burn that fat for energy, whereas that surplus simply isn't there.

It’s anecdotal, but I believe I’ve experienced similar effects. During my teenage years and for most of my twenties, my body fat percentage was low because I chronically under-ate (mostly just due to bad habits, though there was a financial component too at one point) and was pretty thin. Energy peaked and valleyed quite a bit with the after-lunch crash being the worst.

After I started working out and adjusted eating habits to accommodate that, my baseline weight jumped 20lbs or so. Some of that was muscle, but body fat percentage increased too. Since then energy levels have been much more even throughout the day, even during periods where I wasn’t working out (e.g. during pandemic lockdown) and I think it’s because there’s always a bit of fat to burn where there hadn’t been before.

I would rewrite your last sentence as:

You can get < 100g of carbs a day and not have negative impacts to your strength and energy.

Meh. I agree keto is too much ,but a standard 'low carb' diet is closer to how we should be eating instead of the carb heavy diet that is typical. You don't need THAT many carbs to feel energetic. But yeah some is nice

It’s kinda tough to get a good baseline of what people are talking about without real numbers - like I’d personally rate my carb consumption as “moderate” - I don’t eat meat so it’s tricky to meet my Calorie needs by cutting out rice and increasing my bean consumption. OTOH the added sugars in my diet are practically zero.

White rice has a higher glycemic index (GI) than sugar (sucrose).

Yeah, that kinda underlines my point, that without actual numbers, even “moderate rice and no sugar” isn’t particularly meaningful. (FWIW, I don’t eat white rice or other non-whole-grains.)

Yeah and a peeled potato has a dramatically higher glycemic index than straight fructose. Glycemic index is an interesting metric, but it's far from the end-all be-all, especially if you aren't diabetic.

A peeled potato is similarly bad for you if eaten in the same density as rice in Asian cuisines. The typical Asian dish is served with the equivalent of 3-4 potatoes of rice.

I first understood this when I noticed that by avoiding white rice for lunch, I was more energetic in the afternoon. Unfortunately, in Indian culture, it's very common to eat rice at every meal and the corresponding sugar drop is a huge contributor to brain fog / lethargy, as well as the extremely high levels of insulin resistance (and pot bellies) commonly found amongst most Indians. I had to undo a lot of my childhood programming to get out of the constant consumption of rice. Rice is fine sparingly and in moderation, but not in the way it is commonly consumed across asian cultures.

Because sugar is half fructose which is processed in the liver when over eaten. Insulin doesn’t come into it for fructose

I eat a handful of grains a day. Sometimes I make an exception for oatmeal. Anymore, is too much for me. I don't eat added sugar regularly.

> I don’t eat meat so it’s tricky to meet my Calorie needs by cutting out rice and increasing my bean consumption.

Other than eggs and dairy, there is really no good vegetarian protein source. That's my personal opinion. Vegetarian protein comes with a variety of issues.

I wonder if that is really true globally. You can't really escape carbs in some cuisines like Asia and some of them are really doing just fine.

See: The China Study. They are apparently doing much better than the west.

Yes this is because they walk. It really has nothing to do with food if you're at the activity level of the typical American (which is zero, to be clear).

What you're saying makes no sense without context. You say "we" but someone who's extremely active vs extremely sedentary are going to require different macros to compensate.

You can get energy from fat. No human on hacker news except for elite athletes are running multiple miles per day continuously in the way our ancestors may have. And honestly, you still don't really need sugar for that as your body adapts.

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