Comment by breckinloggins | Hacker News Reader

Comment by breckinloggins | Hacker News Reader

Parent Full thread

I, too, have been really disappointed with cooking education online. This is an area ripe for a good startup (that someone else can do, I have my hands full). :)

Some ideas:

- Leverage Google Hangout for some interactive classes

- Use gamification to help users learn some of the more boring fundamentals (basic cooking terms, substitution guidelines, units and measurements, basic baking chemistry guidelines, etc.)

- A better instruction format geared toward using your iPad or other tablet propped up in the kitchen. For example, make sure the user can navigate with the nub of a knuckle or some other clumsy way, so they don't have to touch their iPad with fingers that just got through tenderizing raw chicken.

- That instruction format should probably incorporate a hybrid text-audio-video approach. And by that I don't mean a blog post with an embedded video at the top. I mean a way to constantly review just that part of the video that talks about what you're doing.

- Start with videos about things that are obvious but are useful to see. For example, what EXACTLY should olive oil look and smell like before you add the food to it? On a typical gas stove or electric range, where approximately should the knob be? I'm starting to get nervous about this pan-fry step. Are you sure I shouldn't go ahead and flip the chicken? I think I'm burning it! Those kind of things are currently best learned with the assistance of a REAL cook alongside you in the kitchen. He or she can say "don't you DARE touch that portobello; it's SO not done!" There needs to be a way for the more moment-by-moment learning experiences to be available online.

TL;DR - thinking of doing a cooking startup? PLEASE don't give us another "recipes with an embedded video" site. Please.

I think voice would be a better method of navigation in the kitchen. I don't want to touch my tablet at all when cooking, and I'd love to keep my hands free to do other things. I'd rather say "pause" or "continue" or "go back a step" than try swiping when I've got things going.

Chef hangout is pretty much what you described. It's a live video lesson using Google Hangout. I haven't done it but hear good things.

Also I think a lot of what you want is just being taught the basics. Many of those you can pick up just from a video or in some of the simpler cases even a text description. Your oil (preferably canola if you're cooking with it, olive has too low of a smoke point and is better suited for other uses) looks a certain way (sorta shimmery) when it's ready. Once you know that it's pretty much the same for every recipe.

Some a chef would have to be present for. I don't think you can tell by sight when the alcohol has evaporated when cooking with wine, you just have to smell. You can't tell by sight when meat is done or a bean you're blanching is crisp-tender, you have to touch it or bite it.

For that reason I don't think online instruction will ever totally negate offline the way it can in many disciplines. But it definitely can do a lot better than it is.

Olive oil is actually excellent for frying. Extra virgin olive oil has a smoking point of 405 deg. F, which is similar to canola.

If it is labeled "extra virgin olive oil" you really don't know what kind of oil it is. Particularly if it has Italy anywhere near the name.

Yes, in theory it should be extra virgin olive oil. In theory there are people who inspect it. But if they raise doubt about the authenticity of a clearly subpar product, they get sued in a stacked court system. So everyone cheats and nobody calls them on it.

See http://articles.latimes.com/2010/aug/05/business/la-fi-olive... for an example of a lawsuit that was filed over this in the USA. (Because you really can't sue about it in Italy.)

Um, no. There's a lot of misinformation on oil smoke points on the net unfortunately. Going way off topic here for HN, but see http://whatscookingamerica.net/Q-A/SmokePointOil.htm for an accurate chart. It's ~320F for EVOO vs ~400F for canola.

That makes a noticeable difference in the kitchen. Using olive oil you'll find yourself overheating more often. It's also more expensive, and imparts a flavor, which you typically don't want in your oil when sauteing or pan frying. If you want that flavor, pour a little high quality olive oil on at the end. I do that with something like a pan seared halibut, it's heavenly.

Thomas Keller mentions in his books (I believe both Ad Hoc and Bouchon) that he uses canola for sauteing and pan frying for exactly those reasons. (Grapeseed oil is great, he mentions, but very expensive. Peanut oil is typically used for deep frying.) He's probably the most technical of the chefs with numerous Michelin-starred restaurants so I'm inclined to take his advice.

From the same chart:

Extra Light (Olive Oil) - 468°F

Maybe that's what GP was referring to. I would put the oils with higher smoke points in the chart closer to exotic territory (avocado, ghee, rice bran, tea seed). I buy my Extra Light OO in jugs at Costco.

Short takeaway: I use EVOO for dressing/cold applications, Extra Light for frying.

Extra light olive oil is garbage. One should not use it for anything. It is "a mixture of refined olive oils that are derived from the lowest quality olive oils available through chemical processing."

Do yourself a favor and buy jugs of canola instead. (Really you should buy small batches, as oil does degrade over time, but it's arguably worth the cost tradeoff.)

I use Grapeseed oil for stir fry and like the fact that it produces no smoke at all. I get from trade joe in a small bottle. Do you know anyplace that I can buy in larger size? Thanks.

Grapeseed oil is expensive. It's a better oil than canola, especially for something like mayo.

I believe it goes rancid though (just like canola) after a time so you should continue to buy in small sizes.

We're doing a lot of this (iPad in the kitchen, text-audio-video, moment by moment tutorials w/ pictures and video) over at http://www.onlinecookingschool.com/ -- I encourage you to check it out. Please send any feedback you have my way!

Looks pretty cool. Biggest feedback is to lower barrier of entry by having a step before the 14-day free trial. Maybe you put together a free package that users can get to and play with without signing in. If they want to save their progress then they have to sign in, which starts the 14-day free trial.

Right now the website just gives me the "this looks like a commitment" feeling, which I'd work to lessen since cooking is one of those things where people randomly get on a wild hare and it lasts a few hours to a few days; you have to hook them during that time or their interest wanes and you don't see them again for a few months/years.

I can't wrap my head around learning to cook online. Maybe it's because I started cooking around age 10, but it's something that responds best to actual doing as opposed to simulation.

Get a simple recipe and cook something. Learn from the experience. Lather. Rinse. Repeat.

Two of the best books I have that "explain" how cooking works (albeit in a very minimal sense) are David(?) Rosengarten's Dean & Deluca Cookbook and Rose Levy Beranbaum's The Cake Bible (now over 20 years old and very, very well thumbed and sticky :-) I'd recommend them to anyone.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com