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Comment by throwaway33945 | Hacker News Reader

Reading this, I couldn't help but think that I am the failed version of this guy. My life mirrors his, except mine is shittier in every way. I did not go to any fancy universities. My math career went nowhere. My deep learning career isn't going anywhere, probably. My h-index isn't even a quarter of his. My only gf left me after a week. My childhood was riddled with family illness. My mother died too soon. And I even look like an uglier version of him.

And I have been managing depression since 16 (I'm in my early 30s). But, I have always questioned whether I really have depression or whether I am justifiably upset at how shit my life is. I cannot imagine being him and being depressed. But I understand that some people have everything, except happiness and peace of mind. It's so confusing.

Thankfully, I don't mess with drugs.

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I’m sorry you feel the way you do. Reading through your post, it is deeply rooted in your view of yourself. When I turn too far inward I can relate. It’s hard because your writing indicates you like to think and analyze, and you have embraced the “warm blanket” of self loathing since it is very comfortable for you.

I hope you don’t find what I'm about to say glib. I don’t mean it that way. I truly believe that you can find meaning through shifting your focus from inside to outside yourself. I say this only because this has benefits to me. I realize that may not mean it works for you, but I hope it will.

Try giving freely of your talents to others. You mention your math career. Try finding people who struggle with math and tutor them. For free. Start slow & easy, and focus on their growth not yourself.

I also encourage you to unplug and find ways to reconnect with nature. Walks where you do nothing but notice the colors of the flower petals, or the rippling of the water. No distractions. Just practicing on focusing outward with no expectations.

I hope you can find some meaning in this crazy life. Sometimes I resort to a pascal style wager - this is by definition my only shot at life, so why not try and see what happens?

You're on point. Really if you look at all the religions and creeds that have stood the test of time, they all kind of shift focus away from satisfying your ego so much. It's so easy for the mind to rationalize this or that as a failure, given enough time to neurotically brood. Even if you're actually in a very good spot in life.

> > Really if you look at all the religions and creeds that have stood the test of time, they all kind of shift focus away from satisfying your ego so much

For the modern day atheist person the formula for happiness could also be

1) Ignore risks

2) Ignore complexity

3) Ignore higher levels in all domains, pretty much disregard classifications better/worse of sorts.

What you also have is a poignient self-awareness. You've struggled, in both the sense of having challenges and in working against them. I'm certain someone important has defined a meaningful life in that way.

The linked note conveyed a world view that felt transactional, low in dimensionality, self-focused. Which isn't to criticize so much as empathize. I understand your comment, but perhaps you have it better than you realize.

Depression is a very real, very serious thing of course

BUT feeling like a failure is 100% incorrect thinking because you are basically using the ridiculous weight of others to judge yourself

Society is weird-AF, do not subject yourself to others judgment, ever

Way easier said than done but "don't do that"

If you haven't hurt anyone you've never done anything wrong.

It is amazing how things change as we get older, perspective is EVERYTHING

Dude; how can you say you are a failure in your early 30s? You have just finished being a kid and learned to navigate the adult work. You still haven't done anything worthwhile, and you're about to start. You have just finished the tutorial to life, and now are facing the question of now what?

Sincerely, a late 30s guy that has been through a massive burnout, mid life crisis and journey to discover myself in the past 5 years.

Millions of people have been through the same in the whole of history. Many have left notes about their experience for posterity. Time to hit the library, my friend.

(The things that have helped the most have been, in no order: talk therapy, solitude, the Tao Te Ching, Alan Watts, Camus, Nietzsche, and many more, rediscovering my long lost teenage dreams, understanding that nature is a crucial part to mental sanity and restoration)

Take care, and good luck.

Really ironically all of life up until 30 is kind of following a general script that's handed to you. And that kind of lets you get out of your own head, in a lot of ways. Then when you're ~30 and you have skills, you have some resources, and you understand pitfalls of life... there isn't much more of a set script left except the wife + kids + white picket fence script. And it takes some effort to figure out how/what your autobiographical script will be. (writing this as a 32 year old who hasn't figured it out)

Vigorously seconding this as an enby in xir early 40s who's only just figuring a lot of shit out and still has so very much left to go. So much left to discovery and explore about xirselves, too.

Seconding that entire list of recommendations, as well. Xe haven't really touched the Tao Te Ching specifically but, speaking as a secular materialist post-theist, tarot and oracle decks have served xe incredibly well as introspective tools. Consider the Oblique Strategies deck if you want to sample a similar experience.

Wishing you luck!

> Vigorously seconding this as an enby

Respectfully, I'm not sure what gender identity has to do with midlife crisis. Happens to every human that has ever lived past a certain age.

I think it’s relevant because, stereotypically, men and women tend to display them differently. I’m curious how it would present in a non binary manner - perhaps that would be the most “true” of them, breaking free of norms?

Indeed. Only cracked xir enby trans egg shortly before hitting thirty.

But xir midlife crisis had far more to do with an abusive ex, "normative" but foolish financial choices, and other mental health issues.

The gender matters were and continue to ground xe more than not: They're an undeniable, celebration-worthy facet of xir identity and a regular source of joy. Gender euphoria is a thing! If you're cisgender but have found deep affirmation in an especially gendered outfit (e.g. a tuxedo or cocktail dress) then you've had a taste of what it's like to go beyond your baseline gender contentment. Hope that helps!

Thanks for the informative reply!

Xir pleasure!

Yeah, but Alexander the Great conquered the world by the age of 18 or whatever, and look how he turned out. Am I a better man than him?

Alexander the Great inherited most of his success from his father. Although a competent and ambitious commander, he would have been a nobody if his daddy hadn’t been Mr. big shot.

And yet most people who inherited the same as he did would have done nothing of note with it and faded into obscurity. Like most of the Macedonian kings before and not long after.

Reality is complicated...

Sorry, who in Ancient Greece inherited the same position as Alexander did? Philip II was a one of a kind, once in 20 generations kind of guy.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Expansion_of_Macedonia_under...

Many people have inherited great power and wealth and squandered it. That's the default case.

Philip inherited too. He built on his father's very considerable success, just like Alexander built on his father's.

Amyntas III -> Philip II -> Alexander III

They're a dynastic set. There's not a lot of sense in separating and comparing them.

But in terms of lasting impact, it's not even close. Philip II exerted control over Greece for a brief time but didn't change much. Alexander changed the entire world permanently.

Just another reason to consider oneself damaged goods, no big shot daddy and not being born a king.

lol.

There are plenty of cases of people who rose through the ranks to become powerful beyond anyone’s wildest dreams.

Adolf Hitler, maybe the most famous example.

Sure, but if you think you are inferior on a personal basis, and inferior on a situational basis, that doesnt boost self esteem.

> Alexander the Great conquered the world by the age of 18 or whatever

He was also, by all accounts, a twat. He killed his friends in bouts of rage. He was a brilliant strategist, but he did not really build anything that lasted. Some slivers of his empire survived, but not because of his actions. He might have lived the life he wanted, we will never know for sure. But I would much rather live the life I have, however imperfect it might be.

> Am I a better man than him?

Are you happy? Do you make other people happy? Do you support or help other people when they need, or side by them when they want? Those are more important metrics than the surface area conquered at the cost of tremendous suffering.

We remember people for their accomplishments, not because they were good as human beings.

He wasn’t a brilliant strategist. He got lucky and was an absolute monarch.

I can accept that, depending on where you put the limit between tactics and strategy. He was good at wining battles and campaigns. He was bad at picking people to run the countries afterwards.

No question that he was both lucky and a despot.

1. He never lost a battle and conquered more territory than anyone in history, all while leading from the front. He's considered the greatest military leader in history by most every other great military leader in history (are you a better judge?)

2. Many of the Diadochi (his bros) went on to great success, and he picked all of them.

People love to be contrarian but it can get ridiculous. Claiming that Alexander the great wasn't actually so great is just boring.

Maybe not, but it's okay to not be the very best, and it's okay to fail. And it's especially okay when comparing ourselves to one of the few dozen names from before the Julian calendar that everyone still remembers to this day!

You're in good company, because the other ~100% of us are also imperfect and make mistakes all the time.

Weight the good more favorably than it sounds like you've been doing.

You take the "bad with the good" just the same as you take the "good with the bad."

And here you have your first true quest: questioning the meaning and value of comparison.

Life is not a race. There is no prize at the end. In a long enough timeline, nobody will remember you, nor Alexander the Great. What is the point then of your life? What is your goal?

Seek to answer this question, and proceed.

From time to time I think most, ambitious, people fall into this trap.

The issue is that these are positional goods. Per definition there can only be a single person who is the top contributor of a field of research.

Every time I fall into this trap I separate out what is positional goods and what is valuables to me. And then I very deliberately convince myself that it is not worth it to chase positional goods for the sake of doing so.

Said in other words: Do research because you like it, not because of the acknowledgement that follows on.

(As a side effect many will find that they indeed do not care doo much about research)

Well put. Chasing positional goods seems inherently vacuous and lacking in satisfaction. It surprises me that anyone thinks that recognition alone is enough to sustain interest in an academic or research career (or other areas like acting). Looking at who succeeds it seems to be people for whom the recognition is an afterthought.

Research is also very taxing on the mind. I'm not sure I could do it for a whole career, as enjoyable as it has been.

depression isn't about quality of life, the disease depression not the effect depression anyway. Depression as a response to environment doesn't respond super well to medication either. Depression the disease process that triggers depressive pathways without the environmental triggers is a different animal entirely.

You’re alive. Just getting through the day should be counted as a great success for pretty well everyone.

Me too... Maybe that's why his note resonates with so many people

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