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Comment by munk-a | Hacker News Reader

What a bizarre statement about a place of business that's tried to irrelevance themselves into non-existence this year. Fast food pricing is now equal or beyond the prices of quality food with non-chain fast food (i.e. doner/local pizza joints) becoming the new affordable option.

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McDonalds is financially quite healthy. They've never been the cheapest nor the best quality. McDonalds excels in having food at the right place at the right time and a minimal effort to transact.

If you are traveling at any random place in the US, and you are in a hurry and want something you are familiar with, McDonalds is the most likely thing you will come across first. There is a huge cognitive anchoring this has.

Don't forget consistency - you can get chicken nuggets and barbecue sauce and french fries that taste recognizably the same at any of their 42,000 restaurants. The food preparation and storage, shipping logistics, and other underpinnings of their consistency trick are admirable, even if the other issues with fast food detract from the overall picture.

That's what I was hinting at "something you are familiar with" and "effort to transact". People hopping off the highway for a quick stop with their family don't want to mull over SlopBowl's menu for 10 minutes, even if it's better quality... they know if they roll into a McD, they can grab a happy meal and the kid won't complain.

But a strawberry shake in the US tastes horrible to those used to the DE version.

Back before teh interwebz consistency was the key to other successful nationwide chains like Howard Johnson's and Holiday Inn.

my friend, people just recently died for eating mcdonalds.

They're rapidly burning part of their core value proposition for finances. They are increasing transaction friction, via much higher store prices and requirement to use their app, forcing use of touchscreen ordering, etc.

Boeing appeared quite financially healthy in summer 2018 as well.

At all the McDonald's I've been to recently, you can still walk in with cash, give your order to a human, and walk out with a bag of food. You don't have to use the app. You don't have to use the touchscreens.

But you often have to wait 10 minutes for someone to show up at the cash register or to let you beg for a refill

https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/12/business/mcdonalds-self-serve...

I'm not sure that having a franchise fall out of the sky would be so harmful to McDonalds though.

> If you are traveling at any random place in the US

And not only in the US. McDonald's is big in some European countries like France. In small towns, McDonald's may be the only option available past a certain hour.

My relationship with the company has evolved though. When we were teenagers, we loved McDonald's. It was also not available everywhere and quite novel, so we would sometimes drive a long way with my mom just to go there. Nowadays, I'm much more concern about my health so it's really one of the last option I'd consider. It feels they have become dirtier than what they used to be though, but maybe that's subjective.

I basically never eat at McDonald's personally but I expect a lot of people just default to it as the predictable option that isn't too bad for their tastes and doesn't cost too much.

We end up there maybe 6 times a year now that we have kids. It's the correct option when we're on a road trip. Like another commenter said, it's consistency is a huge selling point and kids will never say no to a Happy Meal.

You don't have a lot of options at interstate service plazas. Yeah, I'll grab some fries at a McDonalds or a Burger King maybe a few times a year if I'm driving and hungry. Depending upon where I am I may go to a more local place I know but it takes more time.

Perhaps, but a lot of these arguments have been used for Starbucks, where it seems like their relentless streamlining and price increases have been catching up with them.

McD's has been on a similar path, and have reintroduced $5 meal deals in an attempt to bring customers that have been priced out back.

In my country just a hamburger is 5 euro. Poor people cook their own food- it's the supermarket that operates at a 2-3% margin.

Taco Bell: Te parezco un chiste?

Taco bell has significantly fewer locations, it's less likely that your next exit has one.

Out of curiosity, apparently US totals are Subway 20k, Starbucks 15k, McD's 13k, Dunkin 9k, Taco Bell / Burger King 7k, Dominos / Pizza Hut / Wendy's 6k, then others.

Subway is a good reminder that location matters too. While they have a lot of locations, they are not nearly as selective in where they go.

Subway is also an optimization in franchise virality and typically doesn't own its own real estate.

I.e. they will let you open a Subway franchise today and me another one across the street tomorrow.

Also something of an exercise in my experience of how bad sandwich franchises can be.

It's interesting watching the cycle of startup -> optimization for customer value -> brand buyout -> optimization for profit.

F.ex. Blimpie (MTY 2016), Jimmy Johns (Roark 2016), Firehouse Sub (RBI 2021), Subway (Roark 2023), Jersey Mike's (Blackstone 2024)

Subway's really the only one of those I have any personal experience with. But from my perspective it's pretty much long been awful.

I remember Subway being somewhat better in the mid-90s. Still not great, but better. E.g. tomatoes were actually ripe

It's indeed crazy how expensive McDo meals had become. When I was a student I used to eat 2/3 hamburgers 1€ each, and something the 2€ local thing too. Now those doubled or tripled. A maxi best of is at least 12€. Sorry but at this price I'll eat anywhere else. The only thing I'm eating these days is the 5€ menu with 4 items in it, the happy meal at 4€ when there's Pokémon cards as toy and the Mac First when it is at 6€ (spoiler: it's often closer to 7€ in most place now).

That being said even kebabs are a luxury now. What used to be 3€ or 5€ with fries and drink is now 7/8€ alone, or 12€ in combo with fries or drink. Well, one more think I'll eat way less than before.

The meals are pricey, no doubt, but the app is where the real value is.

In NYC, I’ve scored insanely cheap deals—last week I got 10 chicken nuggets for $1. Right now, I’ve got a 50¢ double cheeseburger offer staring me down. I’d redeem it daily if it weren’t for health reasons (it says once a week, but for me, it’s somehow available every day).

And don’t sleep on the $6 meal deal: a McDouble, 4-piece chicken nuggets, small fries, and a small drink. For six bucks, that’s tough to beat!

Given that the app exists and will save you money it's hard to discourage its use but it seems pretty clear their goal is to obsolete in-store menus to obscure the real costs of their meals. Customers get deals in the short term to encourage conversion but in the long term it will be used for price gouging.

Though long pre-app I remember McDonald coupons in at least school newspapers and the like.

I remember one pretty silly case where a coupon gave you cheeseburgers for less than hamburgers. The local McDonalds wouldn't let you order a hamburger at the cheeseburger price so you ordered a cheeseburger "hold the cheese."

Or you make your own meals.

Have you spent much time in their dining rooms? Niche as Chris Arnade’s expertise may be, it sure seems hard-earned:

> I can answer both questions. I’ve spent over a decade sitting in McDonald’s all over the United States—I believe I’ve visited over 500 franchises. Roughly half the conversations I had for my 2019 book Dignity took place in a McDonald’s—in fact, my working title was, Everything You Want to Know About America Can Be Learned in a McDonald’s, because I sincerely believe this.

Yes but they are not everywhere. As much as hate the below mediocre junk McD mostly produces, sometimes they are the only place open for miles around.

Costco is my new restaurant. Food is more fresh and costs way less.

I have thought that, if you're on a road trip, Costco could be pretty good. Stop there, get a rotisserie chicken, feeds 2-4 people, costs $5. (I mean, you still need a trash bag, paper plates, and a large number of napkins...) And you were going to stop for gas anyway, and they have that.

Maybe at mid-day during the week. On Sunday, the Costco parking lot is the last place I'd want to be if I'm trying to get miles on the road.

Yeah that sucks. It really depends on the time.

Yeah man, almost perfect, and they have desserts too! Sadly no coffee...well just packaged ones.

If only they had a $1.50 hamburger option!

but not as convenient as McDonald's . fewer locations, need membership afik for food

Yeah that's true. Fortunately we have one 15 mins of drive away.

I have been wondering if this should be seen as a success of laws raising minimum wage. In some states, the rapid rise of minimum wage means that it is no longer viable to have someone else make a sandwich for you. Isn't that a victory for those who want equality?

Reminds me how one-type-fits-all smartphones are sold as premium devices.

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