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Comment by codingwagie | Hacker News Reader

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In 2022 there were ~57k PHDs awarded in the USA [0].

In the same year, there were ~500k immigrant visas [1].

If every single PHD was for immigration, it'll still only be ~10% of the total. And even if the thesis was "forced", just getting to PHD level means you're very much in the top echelons of education, and even then takes multiple years - as someone who immigrated with "only" a BSc I suspect they'll be able to use one of the many other paths instead with less effort.

I'm not sure the logic holds.

[0] https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaeltnietzel/2024/02/05/numb...

[1] https://www.bal.com/perspectives/bal-news/united-states-us-v...

That’s a lot of mental hoops you just leaped through. Are you saying you think immigration policy is the main contributing cause of poor research quality? Because that is a wild claim without evidence. Also doesn’t really make sense, immigration policy varies from state to state and there isn’t just one single country producing research.

Some huge percentage of STEM graduate school is just for immigration

These people are not seeking "truth"

Aren't they required to have previous schooling in their home country, pass an aptitude test against others, and maintain good grades to stay in the program in order to stay in the country?

I don't see how you can avoid actually doing the education part here. And I'm sure lots see immigration + better education as a win/win, which I don't see a problem with.

Where are you getting the huge percentage from? Do you have sources for your claim? Even news articles?

The numbers I find say about 20% of grad students in the United States are international students. I am not sure that is a huge percentage?

What does that statistic look like for other nations?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

>These people are not seeking "truth"

Careful with those absolutes, there. And the whole "these people" thing, too, probably.

Evidence?

Especially given the context.

What kind of evidence would sway your belief on this matter?

Perhaps a published academic research paper on the topic?

> What kind of evidence would sway your belief on this matter?

I do not have beliefs on this matter, I am interested in data. I would like to know what studies of graduate student intentions and outcomes

> Perhaps a published academic research paper on the topic?

I see what you (think you are) doing there. That would be a start

It would be start, for people like you who hopelessly cling to your deference to the authority that academic research papers exert over people like yourselves. For the rest of us, it would be meaningless.

> For the rest of us,

I am curious: What are your decision criteria?

Academic research papers are systematically flawed, true. But they form a part of the story of finding truth.

What do you use?

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