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Comment by NoMoreNicksLeft | Hacker News Reader

> Greeks have not given up on sex; they are simply responding to economic incentives,

There are places in the world with far more horrible economies than Greece that have no fertility rate problems. There are places elsewhere that have much better economies, and similar fertility rate problems. It's not economics, not even a little.

When you teach your youngest generation to not want to have children, not only do they take the lesson to heart, they teach it to whatever children they do end up having by accident or apathy. Instead of going away or even just lingering, it is self-reinforcing.

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I agree that it is not economics, or at least that their argument about economics does not suffice.

This is not a challenge and I am genuinely curious to hear your perspective: in what way does Greece teach their youngest generation to not want to have children?

Dozens of different ways, I should think, but foremost among them is by example. If you mother only had the one child, or maybe two... you don't grow up to have seven yourself. But then they send young children to school where many or most of the teachers are childless women. Their television programming will portray most women as childless, and those without children as being the happiest, and so on. I don't know anything about Greek comedy entertainment, but if it's anything like that of the rest of the western world, there will be all those groaner jokes about how horrible having a family is.

There are other childless cultures where these aren't the major factors in childlessness, but Greece doesn't strike me as one of those.

"It's not economics, not even a little."

I don't think you understand the economic and quality of life decline experienced the generation that is now 30-40yo.

There may be places where worst economies, but the rate of changes counts as well. The middle and lower class were at least 3-4x better off 20 years ago than what they are today.

You're wrong, it has to do with culture. Very little is effected by economics.

It reminds me a lot like hobbies people associate with rich people, like traveling.

If traveling is a real hobby for you, you will find a way to do it even if you're poor like I did when I was young. For me it was through mistake airfare scanners and hostels, but some very poor 3rd world people literally just walk / bike around the world. Sleep in tents, and pan handle / or do some odd jobs for food money.

If there's a will, there's a way.

Then you'd see higher fertility among the upper class, who have it about as well as the middle class had back then. You don't though.

It's just the excuse you use for something you don't understand about yourself. Go talk to the r/childfree crowd, ask them if they'd ever do it for any amount of money. They won't, and neither would you. They at least understand themselves a little.

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