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Comment by tristor | Hacker News Reader

I have been an Amex card holder for nearly 30 years. It's one of the few brands I have real loyalty to because they've saved my bacon so many times while traveling and in other ways.

The conclusions of this analysis match my own personal experiences discovering that friends and others I had success with in business were also Amex cardholders. Amex cardholders are generally more affluent and better at understanding and handling their own finances compared to cardholders of other brands. I chalk that up mostly to Amex being more selective about who they issue cards to.

As an investor that means there's a lower risk (or higher risk adjusted return) for every dollar Amex holds on its books compared to other card issuing lenders.

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Also have a fierce loyalty to AmEx as a customer. I use it as often as I can to pay for things. Their customer services is phenomenal, and its nice to have an arbiter between you and a merchant when things come up. Anytime I've had an issue with a merchant, I try to work with them first, and then jump to Amex if they aren't willing to work with me. In every instance Amex has been able to fix the problem, typically by refusing payment to the vendor after an investigation. It's like having insurance for your purchases.

I say this as a generic green card member of 25 years. I know a lot of people pay for higher tiers for travel benefits, but the base service has been excellent for my needs.

> It's like having insurance for your purchases.

All credit cards provide this, though. Certainly not all will have exemplary customer service but I have a Chase card I've successfully disrupted transactions through as well.

Apple Card's service is terrible, have heard of multiple people denied a chargeback for obvious fraud or services not provided.

I only use it for specific Apple purchases and Apple Pay for consumable goods now.

This doesn't sound like something a rational, financially-savvy person would write - instead, it sounds like the opinion of someone who is easily manipulated by a few sales-driven anecdotes. The comment just sounds like a shabby advertisement.

Also, are most Europeans financially illiterate and poor since they aren't AmEx customers and have general disdain for the debt-driven economy of credit cards?

I think your tone is not helpful here. The parent isn't attacking you.

Clearly US & ROW card markets are wildly different due to various regulations; the structure of the US market and related incentives are pretty unusual. A statement about a US-based experience doesn't & can't translate toe Europe.

AmEx, at least classically (though less so today) is a “charge card”, not a “credit card”. It’s a subtle distinction, since they do extend short-term credit, but until Pay Over Time became a thing recently, your AmEx bill had to be paid in full every month.

As they made no money from balances carried, they have traditionally had higher merchant fees and annual fees for cardholders. The flip side, for the merchant, is that wealthy American cardholders vastly prefer using AmEx, so if those are part of your target market, you are much better off accepting it.

I don't think they meant anything about Europeans since Amex is primarily an American brand. I think the data proves it out and it could also have something to do with their history as a charge card (i mentioned in another comment).

A charge card means that if you decide to put $10k on the card to buy a new big thing, you need to have 10k to pay it off at the end of the month.

That would logically self-select for people who have the financial ability to pay off a card that has an 'unlimited limit'. As the card levels go up, you've also got hefty fees ($500+) which again select for people who view $500 as a small price compared to the benefits.

I think the OP was rational in their conclusion. Sidenote, it also has nothing to do with 'debt fueled economy' -- there's no debt accrued with charge cards.

Wow, being accused of a shill at the same time as the most uncharitable take on my comment possible.

I'm in no way associated to AmEx other than being a customer. I'm a frequent traveler and formerly digital nomad (78 countries and counting), and so have had many opportunities to see the benefit of my card. I've even mentioned one particular instance before on HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=36624867 Since HN skews towards people who work in the tech industry, I imagine I am not alone in that many of us are likely folks who both travel often and have an AmEx.

I didn't say anything about Europeans, and I didn't say people who don't have an Amex are financially illiterate or poor, I said the folks who Amex has as customers are affluent and better at handling their finances (read: better at paying off their debts). This is reflected in the data, including what is shared in the post. It's not at all a controversial statement, and espousing the positive side of that coin does not indicate in any way that I believe or hold the views from the other side of the coin.

They really are selective. In my 20s I once missed a single payment to a department store card that I owed $60 to (Not an Amex card) and Amex abruptly closed all my accounts in response. I'd never been late paying Amex, nor did I have anything else negative on my credit.

It took me a decade or so to get over my grudge against whatever algorithm triggered that, but I have an Amex card again.

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