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Comment by dragontamer | Hacker News Reader

> "things we eat that bear little resemblance to the food we have evolved on"

Okay.

So are we ready to ban bread? Is that really what you're proposing? Or white-rice?

> Industrially manufactured food products made up of several ingredients (formulations) including sugar, oils, fats and salt (generally in combination and in higher amounts than in processed foods) and food substances of no or rare culinary use (such as high-fructose corn syrup, hydrogenated oils, modified starches and protein isolates).

So Lays potato chips (only Potatoes, Oil, and Salt on the ingredients list) don't need a warning label?

McDonalds fries and potato chips are fine because they're all natural ingredients, amirite?

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Not here to argue your point, just to note that McDonalds fries are not as natural as people think, ie. most people assume they’re just potatoes fried in some oil.

“French Fries Ingredients: Potatoes, Vegetable Oil (canola Oil, Corn Oil, Soybean Oil, Hydrogenated Soybean Oil, Natural Beef Flavor [wheat And Milk Derivatives]), Dextrose, Sodium Acid Pyrophosphate (maintain Color), Salt. natural Beef Flavor Contains Hydrolyzed Wheat And Hydrolyzed Milk As Starting Ingredients. Contains: Wheat, Milk.”

Source: https://www.mcdonalds.com/us/en-us/product/small-french-frie...

Fair.

I guess replace my earlier comment with Five Guys fries then. https://www.fiveguys.com/-/media/public-site/files/allergen-...

> Five Guys Style [Fries]: Potatoes, Refined Peanut Oil, Salt

Its gonna make you fat and clog your arteries either way.

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My point is that "processing" food doesn't seem to make it more, or less, healthy. The amount of "processing" that Pasta has (Dry the Flour, Wet the Flour, Dry the Pasta, Wet the Pasta/Boil it, and sometimes further Drying+Wetting steps after that) is one of those running jokes in culinary circles.

More processing usually equates to more refining which means removal of micro nutrients. So yes, while five guys fries will make you fat if you eat too many they at least contain the normal micro nutrients of potatoes without added preservatives that may cause other problems

Are you saying French Fries (Simply cut Potatoes, oil + salt) are healthier for you than Pasta? (Ground grain, dried, wet, combined with Eggs, dried again, combined with various sauces made from oils, often dried herbs and other such ingredients)

Because Pasta is a hell of a lot more "processed" than a typical French Fry

You're comparing oranges to orangutans

Not only are they cooked differently but you've added extra non processed stuff to the pasta and culminated in using a simple sweeping term of "healthy"

You can also add herbs to fries and cook them in an air fryer. What about if I add broccoli to the fries and throw some hot sauce on?

Both of those things have a place in a well balanced diet

Bleached, fortified white flour is an incredibly processed ingredient.

It's also got nothing to do with health (or lack thereof).

I guarantee you there are fewer processing involved in Five Guys French Fries compared to white flour alone, let alone all the extra steps before you have a good meal.

Do you think there is a Pesto recipe that has less processing than the typical oils used for French Fries?

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I'm simply pointing out that a Bowl of Spaghetti + Pesto on it is highly processed. To far greater degrees than highly unhealthy and fattening foods we already know about.

> So are we ready to ban bread?

You're arguing in bad faith. Nobody said banning, the article said that there should be warning labels.

So yes, people should be aware that when they get a wonderbread sandwhich it has more sugar added to it than a dumdum lollipop. Some other breads are much less processed though.

> So Lays potato chips (only Potatoes, Oil, and Salt on the ingredients list) don't need a warning label?

"Potato chips are made through processes like frying, adding artificial flavorings, colorings, and preservatives. They are designed to be convenient and hyper-palatable, fitting the definition of ultra-processed foods."

What I am saying is that stores should delineate products that are solely a source of calories from those that meet our nutritional needs. A red/yellow/green system would be useful. Or warning labels.

> "Potato chips are made through processes like frying, adding artificial flavorings, colorings, and preservatives. They are designed to be convenient and hyper-palatable, fitting the definition of ultra-processed foods."

Lays Potato chips are made up of only Potatoes, Oil, and Salt.

Its as simple as you're going to get. I get that you're trying to make "Ultraprocessed" actually encapsulate "unhealthy foods", but there's no colorings here.

Its just carbs, oil, and salt. Of which many Breads have a similar set of ingredients. Your typical Pesto or other "healthy and organic" dips have more processing than Lay's Potato Chips.

That's the thing. I know that Ultraprocessed is just a word tossed around with no definition. Its just everything "wrong" with today's food that rallies up a crowd, but no one has ever actually defined "Ultraprocessed" in a way that matches what normal people understand as "healthy" vs "unhealthy".

In any case, I'm actually for things like increased soda-taxes and other penalties to provably unhealthy foods. But we need to get the definition correct, and "Ultraprocessed" is such a bad baseline for discussion.

How long do you think humans have been cooking food

I posted my own understanding above (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40816168) but since those are good examples, my understanding is:

Lay’s potato chips: not UPF

McDonald’s fries: UPF due to the presence of beef flavor, hydrogenated oils, and other similar ingredients.

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