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j1mmie

This also fits well with the theory that lack of deep sleep increases the risk of alzheimers and dementia:

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/not-getting-enough...

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Just a few weeks ago this appeared somewhere on HN

https://www.sciencealert.com/study-finds-sleep-may-not-flush...

Not an expert in the field, but from what I understand the idea is very contentious with sizeable camps on both sides, especially noticeable if you are talking to an Alzheimers scientist, or a immune system scientist.

> sizeable camps on both sides

There are dozens of us! Mostly because Nedergaard's lab(s) are like 50 people all by themselves.

I always find it interesting what people's perception of the size of academic subfields is. For most topics in the biological sciences (i.e. excluding cancer, HIV, malaria, AD, and other "whales") you can fit everyone that has directly worked on that topic in the last 5 years in a medium-sized auditorium. And many people work on multiple topics!

Very interesting article! However, the reduction of clearance rate (30%) is not a lot. It is possible the brain produces even less toxins while asleep. And the article also acknowledges there may be an increase in "bulk flow of fluid." All that said, this study was done on mice, so it's hard to draw conclusions.

@clumsysmurf, nice catch!

Could it be possible that the coffee lobby is behind this 'counter'-study?, since a relatively simple inference from the OP has catastrophic consequences for the coffee business:

Deep sleep is necessary for the slow electrical waves that clear the brain of waste including amyloid proteins. (Excessive) coffee intake reduces the quality and quantity of deep sleep, thus leading to a build up of waste products including amyloid, resulting in cognitive declines such as Alzheimer's etc. Therefore, coffee intake (indirectly) causes Alzheimer's.

Admitting that last part is suicidal for the coffee business.

@dukeyukey, from these '_lot_ of studies', if we remove those that are directly or indirectly funded by the coffee lobby, are we left with the empty set ∅ ?

Do you think I would have posted that if what you say is true?

We have a _lot_ of studies and evidence that says coffee reduces overall mortality by quite a bit, and it holds for both caffeinated and decaf coffee. It seems like coffee specifically reduces the risk of Alzheimer's as well.

That result is almost certainly bullshit, at least for Alzheimer's. Or the effect is so minimal that it doesn't practically matter.

Why? Because Finland is the country that consumes the most coffee per capita in the world. Finland also has the highest amount of Alzheimer patients per capita. Correlation is not causation, but based on this, it should rather be suspected that coffee causes Alzheimer's rather than helps with it.

Could Finland's high incidence of Alz also have to do with its high latitude and Finlanders' lack of Vitamin D?

I've read that exercise negates all of this...

I've found out (the hard way) that chronic lack of sleep leads to not having enough energy for intense workouts... (walking is ok though)

Failing lifts is strongly correlated with a bad night's sleep.

Source: skimming various forums and personal experience et al, 2024.

I do not understand what 'failing lifts' is in this context?

I know how much I am normally able to lift each exercise. So let's say 125 lbs shoulder press, I expect to be able to lift the weights 10 times the first set, 9 times the second, 8 the third set. If I can't lift the weights 10 times I failed early.

I can only assume it means failing to lift a weight in the context of gym exercise.

Basically failing to lift weights that you could lift say last week. There are other factors too of course like fatigue, food, etc. that can make you fail to lift the same weights.

Ahh but working out makes you sleep better. The workouts dont even need to be intense!

> exercise negates all of this...

That would be logical taking in mind this article

In what way? It can make up for a lack of sleep?

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