Hacker News Reader

Comment by sneak | Hacker News Reader

As a professional poker player, using weirdo denominations for cash games is not something anyone ever wants.

The denominations are $1, $5, $25, $100, or $5, $25, $100, $500, or $5, $25, $100, $1000.

In Vegas, the $5s are almost always red, the $25s are almost always green, and the $100s are almost always black.

Even the $10 chips in use for the 5/10 games at the Wynn and Resorts World throw off a lot of players.

Casinos frequently have $2 chips simply because it makes dropping the rake take less volume and allows them to change the boxes less frequently. You don’t need them in a home game.

This might be an interesting math problem, but let’s not pretend that it has any applications in actual poker games.

View on HN

The default buy-in for the site is about $10, which is perfectly reasonable for a game between friends. I've almost never played a game where the pot exceeded $100 (we had 6 people in a $20 buy in once, I think) and most of my friends have never played a game where having a $100 denomination would be any use at all.

This is something that most amateurs want, it's OK if pros don't want it.

Why have any denominations for chips then? If the total value at risk is $10-20, just play for fake points. This isn’t remotely significant money for anyone.

I play with low stakes amateurs all of the time, as often as not in home games, and the smallest games people play are 1/1 or 1/2. You can’t even buy a cheeseburger in America for $1 anymore, anything less than that and you might as well not be playing for money at all; just use points and don’t worry about denominations.

Depends on the crowd. Our $0.25/$0.50 games often have hands that go to showdown with $100+ pots, sometimes $500. Yet, every time someone says "Should we just do $1/$2 next time?" they get poo-pooed :)

Can relate. We mostly play 0.1/0.2 or 0.25/0.50 but I've seen a friend of mine spend 700 bucks in a game while the rest, at most, 100. It makes it very unbalanced but everyone finds it fun to see the big stacks guy lose it all.

I'm going to "well, actually" here and tell you that plenty of casinos have weird chip denominations. Especially where limit poker might be played.

I've seen $2, $2.50, $3, $10 and $20 chips as well as the normal denominations. This site mentions $8s:

https://wizardofvegas.com/forum/gambling/poker/5999-2-3-and-...

This is because casinos run many different kinds of games (both in the poker room and elsewhere). They also are regularly raking standard amounts for the house, and for promotions, not to mention dealers taking tips.

Few of the above needs apply to casual unraked homes game, unless you are playing limit as noted. (I’ve never encountered a limit home game; more and more these are strictly hold ’em or PLO/PLO8, unless the players are over 70. Once in a while if it gets really late and shorthanded someone might suggest a round of stud, I guess)

And even then you need larger numbers of fewer types of chips for limit, as a rule.

$2.50 chips are used for blackjack, where a blackjack hand pays 3:2, so when the table bet size is a multiple of $5, you need something to represent half of that.

I usually just see them with a stack of $0.50 coins.

I think you missed the point: OP is playing with friends and made a tool for such situations. Nobody suggested using this in a casino.

I’m saying that poker players don’t ever want to play with nonstandard denominations, even in a home game.

It’s just not done. It also makes no sense: it’s confusing and slows down the game for no reason.

in a standard casual home game i feel like we'd be playing with denominations you never see in casinos anymore anyway (5c,10c,25c,50c,$1) etc.

I’ve mostly seen chips treated as a unit-less or self referential unit: white is 1, red is 5, etc. 1 or 5 <whats> is irrelevant if you’re playing tournament style play. At the end the top x% of players get a scaling percentage of the actual monetary pool. Now if you’re playing where you can cash in and out at face value at any point then using chips in a 1:1 mapping to currency would make sense, but it should still probably be fixed rather than each chip being able to change value based on number of players or the size of the pool.

It would also be very annoying at home games. It would take a special group of friends to tolerate or even get a kick out of how optimally you’ve solved a self-imposed problem.

It’s a fun mental exercise and programming problem, but that’s it IMO.

this is hacker news

makes sense to me

You're clearly not playing games with a $0.25 small blind, or a $20 buy in. Meanwhile, it might confuse professional poker players, but in a friendly cash game that's probably a benefit.

There are no “friendly” zero sum games about money. Either you are playing to win, or you are wasting time. Anyone who thinks otherwise is, obviously, just wasting time (which is okay, but don’t pretend it’s a “friendly game”, it’s just a distraction, not a game.)

If you’re not playing for stakes where you care if you win or lose, then just don’t play for money at all.

I know lots of hobby poker players, firmly nonprofessionals, who play in non-serious 2/5 and 5/5 home games where the buyin is $500-3000.

Penny poker is totally pointless for anyone not below the literal/actual poverty line where $40 is actually lifechanging money. If you’re not homeless and want to play $0.25/$0.50, just play for points/chips then instead of cosplaying gambling.

> There are no “friendly” zero sum games about money. Either you are playing to win, or you are wasting time.

Time You Enjoy Wasting Is Not Wasted Time.

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2010/06/11/time-you-enjoy/

> don’t pretend it’s a “friendly game”, it’s just a distraction, not a game.

A bit of friendly competition is still a game. Games can be fun.

> If you’re not playing for stakes where you care if you win or lose, then just don’t play for money at all.

You can still care you win, but not mind if you lose. That’s a sweet spot. Even a small pot (which is still a multiplier of all players) can get people engaged just that extra bit to take it a bit more seriously. That’s more enjoyable for everyone: you get more investment and interesting plays. The winner gets a some pocket money but no one else is bummed by the loss, it becomes a pittance relative to the enjoyment of playing with friends.

> just play for points/chips then instead of cosplaying gambling.

Why does this make you (sound/read) so irate? Let people enjoy themselves, no one is being harmed.

You seem to be strangely offended by the idea of people playing small stakes home games for fun, and frankly, your understanding of a game seems rather skewed to me as well.

I'm really glad for you to know and hopefully be able to make a living off of non-professionals that can afford to lose several thousand dollars in one evening of non-serious playing. That's a great clientèle to have as a professional gambler, and I see nothing wrong with taking advantage of it. But I'll go out on a limb and say it's probably far from the lived experience of most people, and neither should it be.

Obviously for poker to make sense you need to have a minimum of skin in the game. Which is exactly why you basically telling people here to rather go and play with peas comes across as pretty tone deaf, not to say entitled.

You need to understand that you are projecting your standards on people who have no aspirations to play professionally.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com