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Comment by moritz | Hacker News Reader

Sold to Gilette in 1967, expansion into many different areas after. Then, I guess their story is not really unique, they shared the fate of all European household appliance manufacturers — increasing competition from Asian companies, so by the 1990s, Braun was dead.

After Procter & Gamble bought them in 2005, it now mostly exists as a brand to be licensed (everything other than shaving and electric toothbrushes).

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> [...] they shared the fate of all European household appliance manufacturers — increasing competition from Asian companies, so by the 1990s, Braun was dead.

Miele and Bosch etc are still going strong. So I'm not sure what you mean by 'European household appliance manufacturers': they have faced the competition from Asian companies and survived.

> "Miele and Bosch etc are still going strong."

Not to mention Phillips, Electrolux (still the world's 2nd largest appliance manufacturer after Whirlpool!), and relative newcomers like Dyson.

Philips is not exactly a European household appliance manufacturer, they've sold off most of that and moved into health tech.

> they've sold off most of that and moved into health tech.

..and are knowingly selling, among other things, highly defective CPAP devices.

Nah bruh. Philips and Electrolux are mostly just name brands today that license their badges to be placed on goods from OEM Chinese or Turkish appliance makers.

Electrolux doesn't license out their brand names to anyone, AFAIK. They do operate manufacturing facilities in 16 countries, and 2 of their 3 largest factories are in Europe: Vallenoncello, Italy and Ljungby, Sweden (the third is in Rayong, Thailand - not China!)

With Phillips its more complicated because they've spun off many of their divisions into separate companies, such as the lighting division into Signify NV. So Signify now makes the Phillips Hue lighting products under license. But it's not like they're licensing the brand out to random companies - they're companies that were previously part of Phillips itself.

> "they've sold off most of that and moved into health tech"

They've kept health tech and "personal care products", which includes the Phillips shavers and toothbrushes. Phillips is a global market leader in those products and sells just about as many shavers as Braun does.

You seem knowledgeable about these companies, but can I just please point out that the Dutch company is "PHILIPS" [1] with a single 'L'. I wrote it in all-caps to make it more clear, but see the logo on the linked Wikipedia page of course. Thanks.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philips

You're quite right, sorry. My uncle worked for Philips back when I was growing up and due to his staff discounts, our house was filled with all their products (back when they made TVs, audio equipment, and even computers), so I should know better!

Now days I'm still loyal to their excellent toothbrushes, beard trimmers, and LED smart lighting products.

More accurate would be low margin businesses died off to Asia.

High margin/specialisation businesses are still around. Just because wages don't massively affect the bottom line.

> Miele and Bosch etc are still going strong

Bosch AC units are just the brand slapped on products designed and manufactured in Asia by the likes of Gree, TCL and Midea. Probably their washing machines, too.

> they shared the fate of all European household appliance manufacturers

Not only household appliance manufacturers but also electronics, mobile phones and whatnot. Philips, Grundig, AEG, Nokia, Bosch are just memories.

Bosch is still going strong - I know them as making mid/high end kitchen appliances and power tools.

Philips still around too, though not the recognizable company it once was (might be doing better financially though?…)

They have good clocks, still. Not sure who manufactures them.

They have a clock-specific website, braun-clocks.com, that shows P&G as the registrant.

Can confirm. I have the BC12 on my bedside table, I love it - simple, elegant, does exactly what I need it to do, no more, no less.

“Part of the Herald (Hong Kong) group of companies, Zeon Ltd is a leading manufacturer and distributor of clocks and watches, operating internationally in wholly owned offices in London and Hong Kong.”

And now days the toothbrushes use the "Oral-B" brand, so Braun is only really known (in international markets) for shavers.

No, the electric toothbrushes are called Braun in markets outside the US. I've only seen them labeled Oral-B in the US.

Also, they're pretty lousy toothbrushes IMO. I recommend Panasonic ones instead.

> No, the electric toothbrushes are called Braun in markets outside the US.

In some markets, maybe. In some other markets outside the US, they also use the Oral-B brand.

In both Japan and Germany, I've seen them sold as "Braun".

When? Maybe 10-15 years ago?

Germany: probably 2 years ago. Japan: right now.

I just looked on amazon.co.jp: https://www.amazon.co.jp/%E3%80%90Amazon-co-jp-%E9%99%90%E5%...

It seems they have both names.

Japan is interesting. Maybe the Braun brand is still pretty strong over there. But in Europe and elsewhere you no longer see prominent "Braun" branding on the packaging - and it's been that way for a long time.

You're right that the Braun logo co-branding still features on the devices themselves, though.

Yeah, the battery in the Oral-B toothbrushes are awful, sonic care are much better

That's not the problem I found. My problems were twofold:

1) The Braun toothbrushes are just nasty. No matter how much I rinsed them off after every use, they collected a bunch of nasty crap in the holder. My Panasonic toothbrush never does this.

2) The Braun toothbrushes only work on a single voltage, because their charger sucks. You cannot take the charger with you when you travel between continents. Any decent modern electronics these days don't have this problem. My Panasonic toothbrush's charger works with 100-240V, 50-60Hz power (worldwide), and this is a model that seems to only be sold in Japan.

Also, the Braun toothbrush is huge. My Panasonic is much more compact.

> "No, the electric toothbrushes are called Braun in markets outside the US. I've only seen them labeled Oral-B in the US."

I can assure you that now days they're Oral-B in most, if not all, markets globally. Certainly in the UK, Europe, Australia, and New Zealand they are no longer sold as "Braun", just "Oral-B".

Here's the Oral-B store on amazon.de, for example: https://www.amazon.de/-/en/stores/Oral-BMarkenshop/page/4553...

Tricky to confirm (no need to follow links), but the first hits on Amazon UK[0], Amazon AU[1], Amazon US[2] are clearly labelled Braun in the images. Amazon Germany[3] and Amazon France[4] too.

[0]: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Oral-B-Vitality-Toothbrush-Includin... [1]: https://www.amazon.com.au/Oral-B-SMART-Electric-Rechargeable... [2]: https://www.amazon.com/Oral-B-1000-Rechargeable-Electric-Too... [3]: https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Vitality-Electric-Toothbrush-Clea... [4]: https://www.amazon.fr/Oral-B-Vitality-Action-Brosse-%C3%89le...

Yes, but they still feature the "Braun" co-branding on the device, but the primary naming/branding is always "Oral-B".

The co-branding is because the device (electronics) are Braun, and the bristles/brush-heads are Oral-B.

Well, yes, but both the toothbrushes and the brush heads are sold only with the "Oral-B" name in most countries. That is: Braun logo still appears on the device, but not in the product name, box, and marketing materials.

Don't use Amazon for reference, use something like Boots and you'll confirm it immediately.

Alright, here you go https://www.boots.com/oral-b-pro-3-3900--black-and-pink-elec...

Going to the American Boots site is malicious compliance at its finest. I actually lol'd.

Huh? It goes to the UK Boots site for me. Where Oral-B toothbrushes are definitively called "Oral-B".

Does Boots even operate in the USA? They're part of the same parent company as Walgreens so I'd be surprised if they did.

In all English speaking European markets they're Oral-B.

https://www.currys.ie/appliances/health-and-beauty/electric-...

Not only that, but they're frequently the top position in the year-end 'best of' on both the legitimate consumer review sites and the more credible outlets

https://www.nytimes.com/wirecutter/reviews/best-electric-too... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/recommended/tech/best-electric-t...

My toaster, kettle, coffee maker, emersion blender, hand mixer, shaver and toothbrush are all labelled Braun (the toothbrush also says Oral-B, but that co-labelling started in 1984[0]). That said, Proctor & Gamble makes finding Braun appliances in North America rather tricky (special order only, never on a store shelf).

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oral-B

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