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Comment by moe | Hacker News Reader

Honestly. The hardware is fine. The problem with android is still the software and only the software.

I'll take my handset in pink polka dots if it can finally scroll smoothly everywhere and not constantly annoy me with bugs in almost every single basic feature.

Instead they keep on shoving out bigger screens, faster CPU's every year - and the only UX issue ever being addressed is the camera finally snapping pics in reasonable time.

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Performance / UI fluidity issues - that hasn't been true since long time now, especially so since ICS. Only hardcore apple enthusiasts and the ignorant keep repeating that (and Windows viruses) ;)

Samsung made $10 billion over the last two quarters selling devices with outdated 2.x Android software. And last time I checked my carriers, none of their myriad of Samsung devices came with ICS.

Clearly ICS and smooth scrolling is not important to the carriers or their typical customers. Consequently, ICS is not important to Samsung.

It's not ignorant to say that Andriod scrolls poorly. It's just that scrolling performance isn't a priority when you're already pulling in $5 billion a quarter.

> And last time I checked my carriers, none of their myriad of Samsung devices came with ICS

I don't know which carriers you checked, but the Samsung Galaxy Nexus (which runs stock ICS) has been on the market for several months now. In the US, it's available from Verizon, AT&T, and Sprint.

No it's not. In the US it's available from Verizon and Sprint as the LTE version (not completely compatible with the HSPA version) and there is no device available from AT&T or T-Mobile. You can buy an unlocked device directly from Google, but there is no subsidized version available for AT&T or T-Mobile customers.

I bought my HSPA version unlocked in the Netherlands.

I don't think you can consider the Galaxy Nexus a Samsung phone. Yes, it's built by Samsung, but they're more a contractor for Google in this case.

The Galaxy S II and its differing variants in the US all still run Android 2.3, with only promises that they might eventually get an update.

Also available directly from Google.

Android scrolling wasn't bad enough for normal, non-picky users to notice. It's only techies who are used to iOS scrolling who complain about it.

Anecdote: You don't need to be a techy to notice the scrolling smoothness. This is the reason my mother now owns a 4S instead of a Droid 2.

> Android scrolling wasn't bad enough for normal, non-picky users to notice.

To _notice_? Maybe not, but perhaps the price difference vs the iPhone was more important than the smooth scrolling?

Doesn't the iPhone 3GS sell for free and iPhone 4 for $99?

that hasn't been true since long time now, especially so since ICS

That's plain out wrong. I'm on a Galaxy Nexus with ICS.

Scrolling and responsiveness are still major issues.

In 2012 I expect my phone to respond instantly and scroll smoothly, in all but the most extra-ordinary situations. iOS demonstrates how it's done.

On Android ICS my touches still incur a random lag that prevents me from tapping "by muscle memory" like on an iOS device. And I did spend multiple days removing all bloat, running the absolute minimum of background apps (JuiceDefender and a tool for the LED).

Likewise most apps can't even scroll a text list smoothly for whatever reason (lack of hardware acceleration perhaps, but as a user I shouldn't even have to think about this).

If you know any Android device that will survive a head-to-head comparison with an iOS device then I'd be curious to hear about it. I've bought the last two supposed high-end androids (Galaxy S, now Galaxy Nexus) and while there has been a noticeable improvement (largely due to the ridiculous CPUs that we get now) the overall situation is still a joke.

I seriously don't know what you are complaining about. Bought my GNex straight from Google and it is hardware accelerated, is stock Android, had no bloat ware at all, all apps scroll butter smooth and there is no random lag or jerkiness. And I am not alone in liking GNex over the iPhone.

I have a Verizon GNex (got it 9am on launch day) and I don't see lag either.

Try e.g. the calendar (swipe left/right). Or pretty much any 3rd party home-screen. Or pretty much any 3rd party dialer. Or, frankly, pretty much any 3rd party anything.

3rd party software needs to recompile with updated flags to make use of hardware acceleration.

Only 5% of all android devices out there have ICS (http://developer.android.com/resources/dashboard/platform-ve...). Even if you are correct that ICS has no fluidity issues at all, that means 95% of android devices out there have these issues.

My Galaxy Nexus runs stock ICS and has fluidity issues, FWIW, and I'm not an Apple enthusiast. In particular, I've noticed problems switching in and out of the camera app, problems with the contact picture pop up, and with the music player.

You are fooling yourself if you think the iPhone is always smooth all the time, every device experiences hiccups at times. Android used to be worse at this but has come a long way with 4.0.

You are fooling yourself if you think the iPhone is always smooth all the time, every device experiences hiccups at times.

When I read such claims I can't help but wonder, have you even used an iOS device recently?

It's a night/day difference for the constant touch-lag alone. On iOS the screen "sticks" to your finger, on android it runs noticeably behind and even the simplest screens choke.

I can't remember having ever experienced an unexplained "hiccup" on iOS. An app may take a second to open/close/switch. When something loads then there might even be a brief pause. But these are very rare and expected.

That's a fundamental difference to android where random, unpredictable chokes are the norm.

Here is a video of my 2 year old Nexus S running ICS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UCy_urYqDEM

I am going to assume that your aren't trolling and just aren't familiar with what you are talking about. I was using a 3rd gen iPad just a couple of days ago where the keyboard choked for a good second when I opened the browser and tried to type right away.

iOS has advantages when it comes to speed for sure. One of the big things is the user can't screw it up like they can on Android, I've seen many Android phones that are the equivalent of Internet Explorer with 15 toolbars. Android has true multitasking and unfortunately that means that you have to be aware of the apps that you install aren't crappilly coded and running in the background eating CPU and RAM.

I think

Talk about cognitive dissonance. I see close to a 500ms lag on your homescreen swipes.

Here's a screenshot I took of your video at second 7:

http://f.cl.ly/items/2Q2o1n3o1V252e0g3i0e/007.jpg

Note where your finger is in that shot. It has already lost contact with the screen after the swiping motion. Meanwhile the screen hasn't even begun transitioning.

This may not bother you. But let's not pretend the latency doesn't exist when it fills enough frames in a low-quality youtube video to take a blur-free screenshot.

Edit: The issue is also documented here; http://gigaom.com/mobile/video-android-touch-lag-and-a-possi...

There where a few mis-swipes because of the way i was filming/holding the phone, not only that but I have a lot of widgets, which add to the latency of home switching, which you can tell the difference when I'm switching in the app drawer. Also that isn't a low quality youtube video, it was filmed at 1080p. Finally Gigaom is an Apple news site/blog not exactly the place one would go to get unbiased news/reports.

There where a few mis-swipes because of the way i was filming/holding the phone

The screenshot is not from a mis-swipe. Your phone did react - it just took long enough for me to press pause (on a video that was playing realtime!) and take a screenshot.

you can tell the difference when I'm switching in the app drawer

Well, at least we're making progress and you're acknowledging the problem now.

Finally Gigaom is an Apple news site/blog not exactly the place one would go to get unbiased news/reports.

Grasping straws now?

The issue is widely documented (the GigaOM article contains sources). And the video is pretty self-evident anyway, unless you want to allege them of faking it.

At this point I think you are either very biased or <forget it I will spare you the T word>. Here is what The Verge had to say about HTC One X with ICS -

        "I can't lodge a single complaint about the One X's performance, though — this phone screams, and it has the benchmark scores to back it up. I used the phone as my primary device for a full week and can't recall a single incidence of lag or stutter anywhere in the user interface. That's saying something, because Android phones that initially appear to be fast have a tendency to "bog down" over time and during certain operations like app updates and account syncs, but not the One X — it was smooth sailing at all times."

I am sure you can find something laggy if you keep looking for it - you can buy the most lacking Android device and then complain about it all you want - but newer flagship Android devices have pretty much eliminated the lag issues with OS and Hardware assistance (Tegra3 has direct touch for e.g. and even Gruber found ICS much nicer!).

Which are still low numbers.

My nexus one with animations disabled is sluggish. Mainly dragging maps is embarrassing.

on the other hand, the 3gs of the time is also laggy. And it's not even on ios4

My wife's Nexus One doesn't seem to lag with default animation settings - running CM7. Both 3GS and N1 are arguably old devices in mobile times!

And the 3GS also lags a little from time to time anyway (probably less than a nexus one, but still)

Cm7 here too. Open maps and start dragging it.

It's not the hardware power. It's bad coding. even gmaps fails at standard nonblocking coding for fluid interface.

Have you used an Android phone with 4.0 (hardware acceleration)? At least on my tablet with 3.1 (which also has opt-in hardware acceleration), the UI moves very smoothly.

Seriously - try a Nokia windows phone if you want something that just works.

>The hardware is fine

Pentile screen

Someone hasn't used a recent Android phone or certainly not one with Gingerbread or ICS. I have never, ever, ever, ever experience scroll lag or a lockup on my Android phone with hundreds of apps installed running relatively unstable CM9 nightlies.

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