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Another narrowboater here - though leisure not liveaboard. We moor our 40-footer in Worcester, just off the Severn. I worked with the canals for many years, including a spell at British Waterways and then editing Waterways World magazine, and I still draw the maps for WW. I have a 75%-finished canal mapping app I really need to get round to releasing…

off topic: It's always fun reading the writings from Englanders about topics that are not foreign to America.

I understand the vocabulary that I've never read before but it's like reading a passage from the 18th century. :)

Some of us here would love to see it, or even just hear the concept.

Seconded. There's at least two of us for sure!

It’s always baffled me how the regard that the average Englishman holds for itinerant folk is wrapped in a big if statement:

  if (boat)
     … # All good
  else:
     raise TravellerAlert()

None of us have ever seen a marina or mooring place covered in litter and human waste, or been subjected to petty crime by the boaters.

I have, however, seen the Canal and River Trust's assets stolen from their working boats (steel fencing, tools, the door or something off an excavator if I heard the guy correctly). Not by boaters, but by the nearby travellers.

Why? They are different populations that engage in different behaviors; one group engages in more antisocial behavior than the other. It’s natural to want to avoid troublemakers.

Narrowboaters don't have the same reputation for a reason though. I've only had a handful of experiences with those who choose caravans as their method of itinerancy but they've all been negative. Everyone I know has had the same experience. It's disingenuous to suggest people hold differing views about them for no reason

Double standards are practically a necessity to maintain bigotry. I’d be more surprised to find prejudice that lacks that kind of hypocrisy.

The narrowboaters thast stay near me don't seem to indulge in open air defecation everywhere around, they don't appear to litter and leave plastic and gas canisters in incredible quanties everywhere before buggering off, and they don't go door to door with dodgy schemes.

The travellers that occasionally stay in the field next to my house do all of this and more.

Pretending that this difference doesn't exist and that there's some "double standard" just means you have zero direct experience of the matter and just want to have some self-righteous "UK bad" moaning. Like it or lump it reputations are often deserved and caused by experience rather than by random prejudice.

Wow, all this escalated rather quickly...

You obviously don't have travellers near you.

Our local parks are now much harder to get into let alone if you are disabled as they all have a small rampart across any flat entrance to stop cars and caravans being driven onto the park.

I live in Spain, mate, I know a thing or two about this.

Since we're on the topic, are there regulations about sewerage for longboaters? Are there "hookups" available at mooring spots or is it more of a "well it all gets diluted when we dump it in the river" kind of thing?

You're not allowed to dump any human waste in any of the canals or rivers (ignore the fact that plenty of companies in the UK do this...).

There are two common approaches to dealing with human waste aboard canal boats; cassette toilets which you can carry to 'elsan points' placed frequently along the canal to dump semi-regularly (I hear anything from a week to a month depending on how many aboard). They look like [1] - you remove the bottom bit and carry that to empty. And secondly, pump-out tanks with a macerator toilet which chews up the excrement before being deposited into a tank. They're much bigger so need to be emptied less often (over 3 months for our 500 litre beast). They need to be done at marinas or the ever-decreasing number of Canal and River Trust-maintained self-pumpouts. Costs about £10-17 per pump-out. Elsan disposal is free as is covered by your license fee. Hundreds of thousands of words on forums have been written about the pros and cons of either of these approaches, and is considered on the canalworld forum to be a bit of a holy war.

A much less common approach is composting toilets. There's not a lot of room on boats, so storing the waste long enough to turn into an effective compost doesn't seem too feasible. And then once it's done, what are you gonna do with it? You're on a boat, you don't have a garden. And recently CRT informed people that they cannot dispose of this compost toilet waste in their provided refuse bins.

[1] https://marine-deals.freetls.fastly.net/media/catalog/produc...

bool boat = social_standing || affluence;

This isn't really true.

You get lots of people living on boats because housing is expensive (like my mother and stepdad).

You do get plenty of "crusty" boat people, but generally they keep themselves to themselves.

Maybe this is because people on boats are often in public and accessible places, where people will quickly complain.

They still own where they live though.

How is this different to travellers owner their caravans? Most people who live on boats don't own a permanent mooring. They either continually move around, or rent a mooring.

Lovely! I'm Irish, we don't have it as much. But I'd love to do a canal boat holiday. Doddleing along the canals, stopping in a lovely english country pub... oh I can dream.

I made WaterwayMap.org, and one of the view is for anything OpenStreetMap considers “boatable”: <https://waterwaymap.org/#tiles=planet-waterway-boatable> I know nothing about this topic, so if there's anything missing, I'm willing to add it.

I'm not a liveaboard but I live in an archipelago and have done my fair share of commercial fishing.

IMO: When the weather is nice, there is no better way to travel than by boat. If the weather is poor, there is no worse way to travel than by boat.

That said, while being stuck at anchor due to bad weather can be frustrating, there is something pleasant about laying next to the stove while you're being tossed about... Unless you're trying to sleep while you're listening to your anchor drag.

Is it literally possible to hear sound of anchor being dragged or is it sound of some kind of nav instruments?

Fellow boater here - I live on a Dutch Barge. Also awake at 0530 with creaking lines in this storm. Lovely lifestyle. We registered our new baby’s address as the boat on a birth certificate last week and had no problems. Good luck to any future researcher geocoding that! I expected a postcode to be required but it wasn’t :)

Ah I love a Dutch barge, does yours have functioning leeboards? Very surprised you didn't need a postcode for the address on the birth certificate - although I suppose if it's 'place of birth', it could be anywhere really and that place might not have a postcode.

No leeboards I'm afraid - mine is a replica Luxemotor built in 2011. I have a friend with leeboards and they are beautiful but without sails they are just ornamental and one more thing to sand and varnish!

Surely a berth certificate?

A few years ago, we decided to travel to Wales, mainly to visit the Doctor Who Experience, but also to pay Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch a visit (for the novelty factor). We flew to Stansted and then drove through the English countryside and had a truly magical moment, when we decided to stop for a short rest. In small town we drove onto a parking lot, and then followed the sign to a small park/picnic are. The park was right at one of the waterways and there lay a few of those narrowboats and one or two were navigating the channel. It was such an unexpected sight, it felt light out of this world. Before that I had never heard of them.

Later I saw a depiction of life on such a boat when my wife watched Call the Midwife. It must have been Episode S05E07.

You can find a show or two on streaming services that expose life on narowboats.

There are several narrowboaters who record their travels on YT, perhaps the best, certainly one of the first, is "Travels by Narrowboat", with 6 seasons on Prime[1] and the more recent years on YT[2].

[1] https://www.amazon.com/s?k=travels+by+narrowboat

[2] https://www.youtube.com/@CountryHouseGent

Kevins videos have always been great, and from the same generation of “BoatTubers” as myself and my wife and dog (we’re Minimal List), but there were earlier (including the slightly more venerable CruisingTheCut) and a whole slew of great channels that came later, all speaking to different tastes and styles and audiences. My personal favorite as an introduction to narrowboat life has been Robbie Cummings for a while now; he ended up on the BBC as Canal Boat Diaries, so the production quality is just great, and he’s also about the nicest and most affable fellow I’ve met on the canals, which in this community is saying quite a bit.

How interesting that you're on HN. We regularly travel up and down the ship canal to/from Manchester. Give me a shout if you're ever in Manchester again, I think we'd enjoy a beer.

I spend 8 months a year on my narrowboat moving around the canals as I hunt for pubs, relaxation and peace. In winter I hibernate in my house, pining for the canals and freedom.

Also, I work full-time from the boat.

Loved the canals when I lived in England (Leeds). I didn't narrowboat, but rode bike (including commute) on the canal sidewalks.

Canals tend to have wildish nature around them (quite rare in England) and they are digged totally flat (with a very subtle incline/decline, apart from waterlocks). They have decent sidewalks that make them ideal to bike along (quite rare in England). They are very long so you can have a daytrip to visit multiple towns. And they don't have cars (quite rare in England).

Canals are great!

The "sidewalks" are towpaths - horses and/or people would walk along those to pull boats along.

If you were to give take a broad guess at the cost of moving around like that, in terms of maintaining supplies and securing a place to stay when you’re not in the mood to move with the current, what would that come out to, say monthly?

My 0.02p, it cost about £6000/yr to do it cheap. Goes up to £10k/yr with a full time mooring in a marina and outsourced services.

Boat pricing comes in a spectrum that very roughly looks like this:

3. £20-£40K Narrowboats are thirty or more years old, or are under 50ft. They have had many owners each of which will have done something to the boat. The engine fittings will be old eg. coolant hoses , the radiators might not work, the fireplace might need replacing, there is rust in important places needing welding and so on. There may be overplating on the hull to repair holes. In general, you can expect to perform regular/constant maintenance and repairs to maintain and keep them in working order. (some people enjoy this, you may not)

4. In the 40-60K range expect the boat to be about 20 years old. Generally modern and most things will be working but it might not have a good electrical system for modern lifestyles. It will have 20 years of wear and tear, and the interior might feel old and outdated.

5. In the £100k-£120 range you should see 5-10 year old boats. It probably will have a modern toilet/shower, modern electrical maybe a solar panel, a nicer kitchen and modern diesel engine/gearbox and propeller.

6. At £160K-180K you can get a new but simple/basic boat fitout probably no solar, no dinette, few cupboards. Or it’s a five year old custom build that has been fully fitted with many extras e.g washing machines, quality inverter/batteries

7. At £200K+ it a brand new boat, built to your specification. An all electric boutique boat is £220K-240K. I’ve heard of narrowboats up to £280K. Luxury wide beams over £350K do exist.

It depends on the level of comfort you want. If you're willing to shit in a bucket and shower once a fortnight then you can do it very cheaply and it'll be acceptable. Try that in a house and there will be concerns for your welfare. If you want a bathtub, on-demand central heating, a big fridge-freezer, bow thrusters, macerator toilets and a permanent mooring with mains electricity then you'll pay much more than you would for a house. Horses for courses. But doing things on boats is fun, and inventing solutions is great.

Edit: You wanted a figure - for the sort of boat you'll find on a canal in the UK. Bottom end: buy a small fibreglass boat for £5k, pay £1k a year for your licence (many at this end don't bother. Another £1k a year for maintenance and fuel )

Top end: Buy a big boat for £300k, £2k a year licence, £6k mooring, £1k insurance, £5-10k a year in maintenance.

Also factor in that boats mostly depreciate (though the last couple of years have been an exception). If you spend £100k on a boat today, you won't be able to sell it in 10 years get that £100k back. If you fail to keep on top of maintenance a boat will rapidly lose value.

You'll often see articles in the newspapers here gushing romantically about how a couple moved onto the canal in order to save money, and it's all so very nice and wonderful. The reality is once you've factored in a mooring, maintenance and other things, it tends to be comparable to living on land. A lot of people can't continuously cruise as we do, due to jobs and other responsibilities.

A few grand a year for a mooring, plus around £1k/year for your license (all boats on the Canal and River Trust's waterways must be licensed). Every few years you need your boat lifting out and the blacking on the bottom re-done (more £££), and in winter you get through a fair amount of coal and other fuel to keep the boat heated (I think we're at about £100/mo for diesel + coal, but some people burn a lot more coal than us).

You really have to want to do it for the experience of living on the canals rather than a way to live cheaply (though it can be done).

There is a massive time Vs money tradeoff with boats.

You can do it for almost zero money (perhaps $100/month) if you put many hours per day into maintaining the boat yourself and making everything you need yourself.

Or you can pay for good gear and get all maintenance done by a professional and your canal boat will be costing more like $3000/month - and when you do that, it becomes a rich persons hobby.

Gush on! This is the kind of thing I love to occasionally see here. Wish I could live on the water, but slip fees are pricey and limited where I'm at. Best to you!

This is incredible! How easy is it to buy and register a Narrowboat? How does it work legally, can you register your home address to the boat?

If you’ve got the money for one it’s easy to buy (see a site called ApolloDuck for used prices) and register, though the specifics of registration depend on which waterways you want to be on (the Canal and River Trust covers the majority, the Environment Agency some key sections, and there’s some odd few others managed by their own agencies). It’s perfectly legal, but as Covid really proved access to services can be a bit confusing, as it’s the mooring, not the boat, that can be classed as having a post code, and pretty much everything in the UK is tied to your post code. So while the boat can be your residence it can be more than a little difficult to access things like GP Surgeries (primary medical care( and other government systems that assume you’re at a fixed address. It’s a great way to live and to see the UK, but it has caveats for anyone with chronic medical issues, for example.

I see, thanks. And I'm also assuming I would need to get some special license to sail a Narrowboat? As a non-UK citizen (EU/Swiss), do you think it could be complicated to get a Narrowboat and live on it for half a year or so?

No, you don't need a licence to pilot a boat on most inland waters in the UK (there may be exceptions on busy commercial stretches).

It would not be complicated to get a boat, assuming you have the money. You basically need to buy a boat, pay for the relevant licences, make sure the boat has the correct safety certificate, and off you go.

You cannot just stop and tie up anywhere. You either need some private land where you will keep the boat, or you need to make sure you don't violate the rules of the public areas. There is a concept of "continuous cruising", which means you need to move on every 14 days (I think).

Anyway, not complicated, but requires a bit of homework. Easiest if you can find a mentor who is already boating in the UK to help you out.

Thanks, very helpful!

A friend-of-a-friend lived on a narrowboat for a year while we were at university.

It was all fairly straightforward, although maintenance cost more than he expected, and he was surprised to find he couldn't just moor it in central London — 'parking' is limited and restricted there.

You'll find plenty of people have written about this, e.g. https://livingonanarrowboat.co.uk/. You could also search "narrowboat holidays" and see if you can hire a boat for 6 months.

I don't think being non-UK will make any difference. You can visit the UK for up to 6 months as a tourist.

Thanks, very helpful!

First I've heard of this, but it's super cool! Can you suggest a blog or small web site to learn more about it?

For the history of the canals, wikipedia[1] has a pretty good page. The Canal and River Trust (CRT) is the current authority for much of the canal system in England and Wales, and they have a site[2] with plenty of little articles on individual little bits and bobs.

If you're after more of a modern angle - i.e., stories and insights from people that live on them (or just use them) today, there are many blogs from boaters, but I tend to not read them unles I come across a particular post addressing something relevant to me (usually repairs...). There are also tons of vlogs and youtube channels where people document their journeys which other people in the comments have mentioned, and even TV shows! I highly recommend Canal Boat Diaries by Robbie Cumming, though outside the UK I'm not sure where it can be found. He also has a youtube channel [3] which is less highly polished and a bit more 'real'.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_British_canal_s...

[2] https://canalrivertrust.org.uk/things-to-do/canal-history

[3] https://www.youtube.com/c/RobbieCumming

So, how does that work when you have to receive letters ? Do you have a PO box somewhere or a home port of some sort ?

It’s easiest to have a home address somewhere you can use as a permanent mailing addresss, but there’s a system called Post Retente that can be used to receive mail at a lot of (especially more rural) Post Office locations. For the most part though it’s best to convert all the bills and whatnot to online delivery and use Amazon lockers and the Click and Collect services offered by many shops to get what you need.

I only found out about narrowboats recently from [1] (found at [2]), and they sound so nice!

I've wanted a tiny house or a skoolie, and I think if I was in Britain, I'd go for a narrowboat just as easily.

[1]: https://qmacro.org/blog/posts/2024/01/09/battlestation-2024/

[2]: https://lobste.rs/s/jrh1od/lobsters_battlestations_screensho...

> I only found out about narrowboats recently

They make excellent walking and biking routes. They are flat, no cars, often have a pub, wildlife is frequently visible and they are usually quiet. Absolutely loves my time biking them in England.