- iMessage works on wifi without a cell connection
- green txts constantly break group messaging to the point where I refuse to add my friends partners who dont have iOS
- there are no abilities to admin group messaging with green txts (change the name, add/remove people, etc.)
It's not just about the color.
This effectively attempts to lock people into their ecosystem, including their App Store, and it's... honestly kind of wild to me (as an American, for GP's reference) that we've been allowing this to continue, in a country with a specific history of using antitrust law to go after phone companies for abusing their network effect to create monopolies.
Upcoming support for RCS is arguably doing exactly that. They didn’t seem interested until they started receiving regulatory pressure, though.
I’m not claiming Apple is beyond criticism here; they absolutely treat iMessage as a moat. But RCS also clearly burdened by competitive interests, including the unclear state of E2EE in RCS.
Maybe I misunderstood what you meant by papering over the badness.
It's not Apple's fault google half assed messaging on android for a decade+.
It’s also clear that Apple was never interested in pushing for an industry solution to this problem either. These two companies are in the unique position to provide leadership in this category, and they haven’t.
In the earlier days of the web and in other areas of innovation, the companies at the forefront of their respective industries industry champion new standards to support their broader goals. This was a use case ripe for better standards, but all parties involved are more motivated by greed than interoperability/supporting the consumer.
The industry (cell carriers) don't want a solution, at least not one that interests non-carriers. It's almost a rehash of the Netheads vs Bellheads fight.
Carriers want a messaging system that requires a SIM and thus a paid subscription to their services. They own network infrastructure and want end users beholden to them to access services. Cell carriers loved the days of WAP and MMS where anything done on a phone was a for-pay service from the carriers. They resent anything that bypasses their ability to nickel and dime people.
Neither Apple nor Google (or WhatsApp or Signal) want a messaging system that requires a SIM and any dependence on carriers' infrastructure. They want an entirely over the top service that transits a completely agnostic Internet layer. Just in practical terms they don't want to only be able to provide service to devices with cellular radios.
RCS is top to bottom a protocol designed by carriers. It requires a SIM for access and hasn't included E2EE because carriers love their data mining. It's a capable replacement for SMS/MMS but it's still tied to carriers. Google and Apple have provided leadership with messaging but carriers are not interested in the direction they're leading. WhatsApp grew primarily because of carriers charging stupid texting rates, especially international rates.
The core problem is groups wanting Internet based messaging get no buy-in from carriers. Even though smartphones are an overwhelming majority of the messaging landscape they're not the only devices used. If the carriers had their way you'd never be able to send a message from your laptop to my phone unless the laptop had a cellular radio and a service plan.
On a side note, I still believe iMessage was in response to Google Talk, whose protocol was both open-source and interoperable with platforms outside of Google.
Google should have never abandoned Google Talk.
The experience is the same coming from an Android perspective.
> People who use iOS should be asking Apple to fix it if they cared about this problem at all.
We do, thanks.
How often are you in a situation where you do have WiFi but don't have a cellular connection? In my experience, the opposite is much more common--not having WiFi but having reliable cellular data.
In any case, WhatsApp, Telegram, Messenger, and open source solutions/protocols like Signal also work on WiFi without a cellular connection.
> green txts constantly break group messaging to the point where I refuse to add my friends partners who dont have iOS
Wow. I feel sorry, not for you, but for your friends who chose to be friends with someone so shallow.
> there are no abilities to admin group messaging with green txts (change the name, add/remove people, etc.)
Who cares? In more than two decades I have never once felt compelled to change the title of a group text, of all things. How often do you need to add and remove people from an existing group text anyways? Group texts, at least for me, have always been ephemeral--for example, a few messages exchanged to coordinate a date and time for dinner plans, and that's it. If I need to add someone, I'll just make a new group text or relay the information independently, it's not that hard.
Your experience is only your experience. It is not the only experience. Off the top of my head in the last year: Cruise ships, hunting lodges, rural restaurants, in tall buildings, a factory, various places underground like hotel laundry facilities.
Wow. I feel sorry, not for you, but for your friends who chose to be friends with someone so shallow.
Wow. I feel sorry for you not having a job that entails using a phone. But many other people do, and are in department-wide our team group chats. Again, your experience is not the only experience.
In more than two decades I have never once felt compelled to change the title of a group text
Congratulations. I envy your simple, orderly, uncomplicated life.
Whenever travelling to a foreign country without paying for expensive roaming.
Happens all the time.. or at least as often as myself or family members travel.
Ummm, all of the time. Traveling, on a plane, etc.
> Wow. I feel sorry, not for you, but for your friends who chose to be friends with someone so shallow.
Huh? When your group message constantly breaks so you can't communicate properly its far more respectful to make sure the couple gets the message than not.
> How often do you need to add and remove people from an existing group text anyways?
I get added to group chats all of the time that I want to leave (due to spamming stuff) but can't because ONE person has an android phone.
WiFi is an interesting one, and some providers already provide SMS over WiFi via the “WiFi calling” feature. It’s certainly more convenient (or at least involves less setup) when iMessage is involved, but I suspect this isn’t the top reason people are clamoring for iMessage.