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Comment by n4r9 | Hacker News Reader

> Even a short and simple conversation can make you feel good.

I think when people prefer to use a digital kiosk, it's sometimes because they have had negative experiences of conversations with service staff. For example, a staff member might give you a funny look if you order something weird, hurry you along if you're pausing a lot, or force you to say "no" when they offer extras. I know that's where my mind goes! Of course short conversations can - and often do - make you feel good, we as humans are not great at focusing on that.

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It's sad for me to admit this but I find online ordering especially for fast food in my area is a much better experience because it standardizes the presentation of the order details for the cashier. When I speak to a human being however I often run into language barriers immediately, and as a result my orders get screwed up more often.

The other side of this coin is that many people take forever at the digital kiosk. If there aren’t enough kiosks and the location is a busy one, I’ll actively avoid that place.

I might as well figure out how to use their website/app at that point.

But all of this leads us further down the path of abstracting/hiding the reality of the purchasing decisions we make. I can’t help but feel this all chips away at our collective humanity.

Yeah a new amazing matcha drink/ice cream place opened at my area. There is always a long line out the door, so I went there to check it out. It was amazing, but the real reason for the long line is that the kiosk wanted an SMS confirmation to place the order.

There was a very tiny "skip" button but most people ahead of me probably didn't see it.

You've never been stuck in a line where the guy at the front is spending forever?

I have been stuck in those lines.

But the average time taken by each and every person at self serve lines seems to be higher, because not only does the person need to decide what they want to order, they also need to figure out the UI at the same time. And there seems to be more choice paralysis when the primary way the customer consumes the menu is the moment they walk up to the kiosk.

In a traditional line, half of the ordering process is typically handled by an individual already trained to rapidly enter the order details, and in most cases, the person ordering knows what they want by the time it’s their turn.

These kiosks are about optimizing cost, and just about everything about the end user experience seems worse.

I can (usually) manage self-checkout at a grocery store, but I find self-service kiosks for ordering fast food to be paralyzing.

There's no way to ask questions. It's not always clear what's on the ingredients list, or how big a particular menu item is, or if a side of rice/bread is included. If I want to ask them not to put something on an order, or to add something extra, I have to go through the entire workflow and then sometimes backtrack. I'm semi-regularly surprised by what I get, and they also usually don't accept cash. The instructions for how to pick up an order and what identifying information to provide are also often unclear.

Sure, I sometimes get something slightly different from what I wanted when I order from a human, but I usually get something at least close. I think I've had a serious mix-up once in my entire life, when ordering in German from someone else who spoke German as a second language. Even then, the server looked confused and double-checked, it was only my own stubbornness regarding my language proficiency that caused a problem.

At fast food restaurants in Canadian cities, I've found that ordering using a kiosk is often the only way to place a complete and correct order.

Due to Canada's immigration policies and economic policies, retail and fast food jobs that used to be done by local high school or college students are now often done by foreign-born adults instead. Unfortunately, many of these staff have poor English and/or French skills.

When ordering a meal verbally, miscommunications and misunderstandings creep in far too easily, even for what used to be simple and routine orders.

At first, I thought I was being unclear in some way, but more and more I started noticing the same thing happening to other people who were ordering before or after me. Communication issues that just didn't exist before have become the norm.

Thanks to this and skyrocketing prices, I don't go to fast food restaurants as often as I'd like to. If a place doesn't have a kiosk for ordering, I'll just leave.

That could be.

Personally, I detest using digital kiosks and strongly prefer placing my order with a human, even if your examples happen.

I stopped going to a sandwich shop I used to visit nearly every workday because they switched to a kiosk to place your sandwich order.

Did you tell them why?

If you want to stop kiosks, it's not enough for you to vote with your feet. They need to know why you voted with your feet. And the place you switch to also needs to know why.

I did, yes. I didn't switch to a new place because there's a lack of eateries in the vicinity of my workplace. I just started bringing my own lunch instead (which is probably healthier!)

Tell them, tell them now!

Is it really kiosk only? I've only ever seen kiosk as an optional with staff at the counter ready to serve.

What do they do at that store if there's a failure on the kiosk or they have to go down for maintenence etc?

Not doubting your story but even as someone who avoids places without kiosks I find that a pretty drastic change.

I stopped going to a sandwich shop because they had QR codes of their menu posted while lining up.

If you can print the QR code why can't you just print the damn menu?

I hate mobile menus, 95% of them are hard to use, most have jumpy scrolling where the thing you're looking at doesn't stay put on the screen as the rest of the page loads (goddamn, use "width" and "height" on your images...), some even throw GDPR popups at you, all kinds of nonsense.

While I agree mobile menus are lacking, at least you don't have to reprint the QR code when the menu changes. You can also update an online menu with things that have run out, special deals etc...

Sadly the kiosk also forces you to tap the "no" button on the screen for multiple extras. One screen at a time.

People don't get the same emotional response from saying no to a screen that they do when saying no to a person.

I find it much more annoying with a machine than with a person. With a person, I can shortcut the process. With a machine, I can't.

That might be so on a psychological level the average person will have a harder time saying no to the human and avoiding the upsale. Clicking No a couple of times can be annoying but so can leaving the store with product you didn't want and the feeling you lost money you didn't want to spend.

The verbal equivalent of angrily stabbing the "no" button would make you famous for all the wrong reasons.

Even the manned checkouts require you to interact with a payment terminal a lot of the time, often with multiple questions to answer.

I don't like the experience of self-service ordering kiosks and checkouts. But usually when I am in a hurry I prefer using them, because unless the software is completely brain dead, the experience is faster.

I do it because the kids can’t make up their minds and I don’t want to make everyone else wait while I beg the kids to say what they want.

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