Probably in the US. In some other countries, it's illegal to refuse a sale, if you're a store (online or offline). A buyer comes, a sale happens.
A woman walks into your bar. You can refuse to solve her because you don’t like the way she does her hair, or the color of her clothes. You can’t refuse to serve her because she’s a woman.
The bar owner would face substantial incredulity from a judge if they claimed that they were turning down business because of how someone's hair looked. That said, the plaintiffs could strengthen their case showing a significant number of women were being denied service, or evidence the owner was misogynistic.
Especially since, federally at least, sex is not a protected class for public accommodation discrimination (it is for employment and housing discrimination.)
It just can't be the only reason.
you can't refuse service to _any_ protected class on the weekends because ... you can't refuse service to protected classes for being in that protected class.
It just can't be discriminatory on the basis of a protected class.
If you uniformly refuse everyone for the same reason but it unduly affects a specific class then you can still be found guilty of discrimination of a protected class.
The canonical example of this is banning all headwear in a restaurant. This has been found to unfairly target certain religions and as such is considered a violation of civil rights.
If you banned all headwear sporting university football teams, that would most likely fly.
Though the US cases on broad headwear bans I am familiar with are mostly not in discrimination, per se, but on failure to accommodate a religious practice grounds (again, a protection that applies in employment and education, not public accommodation, contexts.)
E.g., https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/06/01/411213623... and
This is not theory, the courts have spoken on this. that you're calling this theory tells me you both don't know and haven't checked.
try again.
Dude, dragonwriter said that what you were talking about seems like a specific thing the courts have applied to some areas and not to others.
Your reply seems to ignore the content of that post on the justification that the use of the word "theory" to refer to something that "the courts have ruled on" is such a glaring contradiction as to render the rest of the post irrelevant. If that reply was doing something else and I have misinterpreted, what was it?
Your mode of interaction here is obnoxious enough that I might abandon this thread.
I don't care if you feel reality is obnoxious, take your toys and go home. or stay. quite literally, nothing you do or say changes that the courts have ruled on this already.
The two points at which you are not discriminating at all are uniformly providing and uniformly withholding services. Otherwise you are discriminating based on something, which may be fine or terrible depending on a whole bunch of details.
Everyone is in multiple protected classes.
For public accommodations, all of the following are protected classes under Title II of the Civil Rights Act of 1964: race, color, religion, and national origin.
Everyone has a value on each of those axes, and everyone is protected against discrimination in public accommodations on the bases of each of those.
Race, religion, national origin, sex, these all apply regardless of which specific group you're in under that banner. There are a few categories which are really only defined as applying to "one side", but they're generally not controversial (the laws against pregnancy discrimination, for example). Age is the one big outlier: the law against age discrimination in employment applies only to people over 40.
No judge in the developed world would believe such a contrived excuse.
It's weird how people think this sort of thing is actually a valid defense.
How can I tell that person is an asshole who meant to hurt my feelings vs that person who just said a stupid thing without thinking about it?
I can't, so the reality is that some subset of people are going to get away with hurting my feelings on purpose. The alternative is that people who make mistakes get punished unnecessarily.
Which side of that would you rather the law be on?
That's not what "protected class" means, in any of the contexts in which it is used (employment, public accommodation, housing, etc.)
To the extent it seems like it means that, that's only because, well, the historically privileged are more likely to be in a position to discriminate in favor of those like themselves.
In each of those contexts, race (not "being non-white") is a protected class; it is just as illegal to discriminate against White people in any of those contexts as it is to discriminate in favor of White people.
For each of the other descriptors which actually relates to a protected class, it works the same way where it does.
> It's far fewer words with the exact same meaning as listing all the things that are 'protected', and has an air of honesty about it.
It doesn't have the exact same meaning at all.
Until it goes through the courts, they will likely refuse the transfer of Cybertruck ownership between Tesla accounts...which is surmountable but annoying enough to discourage certain buyers.
This is of course a hypothetical because I doubt there will be any secondary market demand for Cybertrucks in the first year.
I find this surprising. Why do you think this?
Tesla stumbled and the market is now gone. Rivian nailed the high end luxury market and commercial vehicles, F-150 Lightning filled the "real truck" niche, Hummer EV for the people who wanted something that stood out. Chevy and Dodge will have their electric trucks out next year before Tesla can ramp production. Now the $40k single motor base model isn't happening which killed off the buyers who wanted a cheap option.
Not to mention the absolute dumpster fire that is Musk's personal brand, a lot of potential EV buyers won't touch him.
They might still be able to sell some to die hard Tesla fans, but there isn't enough broad appeal to create a secondary market.
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/gm-del...
The Musk cultists will buy.
Our Supreme Court famously applied this to inkjet cartridges, saying a printer maker can't take punitive action against you for refilling them: https://www.oyez.org/cases/2016/15-1189
Ferrari terminated the franchise agreement for the Wynn Las Vegas Ferrari dealership because Steve Wynn sold his LaFerrari before the 2 year window was up.
They famously blacklisted Top Gear for revealing that Ferrari was 'cheating' in their evaluations by arriving with an army of technicians and tuning the car to the Top Gear test track before allowing TG to review it, and delivering the car with tires much stickier than they came from the factory and so on. Every other journalist was gladly hiding all this bullshit because they didn't want to lose access to press cars.
Top Gear hosts said "if you happen to have one of the ____ models and would let us drive it, let us know" during an episode and someone took them up on it.
Ferrari blacklisted the owner for doing so.
I can't say I'm very familiar with the ins and outs, but I don't see anything that obviously does so glancing through it. There is some stuff about "sale or return" that I think is the distributors/wholesalers vs normal sale distinction that you're making, but nothing there seems relevant to this sort of clause.
"The right of alienation is one of the essential incidents of a right of general property in movables, and restraints upon alienation have been generally regarded as obnoxious to public policy [and have] been generally held void." -Miles Medical. v. Park
I can't point you to a specific code that prohibits this because it depends entirely on what grounds Tesla would claim the right to impose such restrictions. For example if they claim that parts of the Cybertruck are patented, the exhaustion doctrine would apply. From Wikipedia: "once an authorized sale of a patented article occurs, the patent holder's exclusive rights to control the use and sale of that article are said to be 'exhausted,' and the purchaser is free to use or resell that article without further restraint from patent law. However, under the repair and reconstruction doctrine, the patent owner retains the right to exclude purchasers of the articles from making the patented invention anew"
Thanks for the citation. It seems to be
1. A case prohibiting this sort of clause when selling to distributors while previously you claimed this sort of clause was only valid when selling to distributors. So I'm left wondering what the basis was for your previous post.
2. Overturned by Leegin Creative Leather Products, Inc. v. PSKS, Inc. Which instead introduces a "rule of reason" based approach for determining whether or not a contraint on resale is anticompetitive and prohibited.
3. Miles, and Leegin, both seem to be about manufacturers attempting to impose a minimum price on their goods. Tesla, strangely, instead seems to be attempting to impose a maximum price (hence the right of first refusal at a pre-defined price). As such the dicta in Leegin seems to suggest to me that attempting to impose a maximum price wouldn't violate the "rule of reason", but potentially only because it wasn't something the court considered at all, so it might violate another ruling.
When this is litigated it will no doubt be complex and touch many areas of IP law, antitrust laws, UCC, and contract law. The contract law angle is interesting because of good faith and fair dealing, which you could make the argument that resale of the vehicle is not material to the purpose of the transaction.
I'd also love to see this blow up in Tesla's face when a lienholder takes possession of a Cybertruck and sells it at auction.
Severability clauses are often one of the unenforceable bits of a contract, though.