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Comment by toss1 | Hacker News Reader

Benjamin Franklin's joke has gone too far.

Year-round DST was tried in the fuel crisis in the 1970s. It was a disaster, waking up & commuting or waiting for school bus before dawn, and still coming home after dark. It was immediately dropped.

Standard time year round (killing DST) is the only real solution.

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One’s opinion of whether ST or DT is better depends a lot on where you live longitudinally in the time zone. People in Maine or Boston will have a different view from people in most of upper peninsula Michigan.

> People in Maine or Boston will have a different view from people in most of upper peninsula Michigan.

After we get rid of the time change, states where standard time makes more sense could just change their time zone to the more appropriate choice. Time zones already follow state borders in a weird way anyway. The state legislature could just have the change come into place at the same time as the national change, so that locally it would be exactly the same as permanent standard time.

Two breaking changes at once is just cruel to the time zone programmers.

Two changes at once are perfect if it means we can skip dealing with the two time changes every single year from now on.

Of if one suffers from insomnia. Or is aware of the mounting research showing teenagers' development is getting destroyed by insufficient sleep

Yet Elementary schools typically start later in the day than High Schools do. That's the first thing that can change. https://www.cdc.gov/sleep/features/schools-start-too-early.h...

It’s changing. CA and a bunch of other states are mandating later school times.

Na. the only real solution is the one we currently have.

Retuning to solar time is the solution. The railroads don’t need four fixed time zones for the entire country anymore.

“I’ll call you at noon tomorrow. In order for me to do that, please tell me your expected GPS coordinates.”

That's how it already works though, just less granular.

Not to be a one-upper but can I call you at around @875 (Swatch Internet Time, AKA .beat time) ?

“Siri, find and propose a time to meet with John, and automatically update my working hours as I change time zones.”

Done.

Any solution that involves everyone being required to bug their homes with an internet connected device or carrying a mobile is a terrible solution. Not everyone has or wants that type of device, and many don't even internet access.

A computer is only required for calculating the time in another state or zone. It doesn’t need to be connected to the Internet. But, if you want to call someone in another state, you already have a computing device handy. Even TVs carry powerful computers these days. Worst case, you have to consult a table.

I know you think this is a conspiracy to “bug” someone’s home by infecting it with the Internet. My wish for you is for a time machine to transport you to the century in which you belong.

With solar time, computer is required to calculate times for everyone. Roughly 20 mi east/west is 1 min in time. It means that people in the same metro area can have different local times. This isn't a problem for spontaneous phone calls but is a big problem for meetings.

My team works from home but is mostly in same metro area. One person is 10:01 in their time, another is 9:59 in their time. The time depends on who makes the meeting. What time do you use when go in to the office?

Ill call you at 16:00 gmt.

Because the earth’s rotation is not actually consistent, GMT can be up to 16 minutes before or after the time when the sun crosses the meridian.

In regards to this aspect of timekeeping, AIUI the earth's rotation is nearly constant. The 16 minute difference is caused primarily by our orbit not being circular. (And to a degree, according to Wikipedia[1], the axial tilt.)

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_time

The point is to use local time for local things (store opening hours, school etc) and gmt for everything else.

I mean, that would be a problem in a world where the phone is physically stationary in a far corner of a house hooked to the wall with a wire. And where I would need to schedule time to sit near the phone so that I don't miss the expected call.

However today, I can text ahead of time to see if it's a good time to call. Or check the shared calendar. Or (if we're sharing phone GPS data) I can find out near real time GPS data and approximate speed.

Actually it wouldn't be out of the question for someone to make a product such that I verbally ask my phone to setup a noonish phone call with someone where our individual AI assistants figure out when that needs to happen based on our schedules and locations. And which can dynamically reschedule as real time events happen.

Solar time is vastly less useful than just getting rid of time zones altogether in favor of Universal Time. If you're going to consider drastic measures, might as well just do that. Trying to plan a meeting? "Is 12:30 okay?" "I won't be up until 2." "How's 3:30 then?" Zero thinking about local / solar time or time zone math required.

Need to call someone without a pre-arranged time? "Hey Siri, is the sun up right now in Sydney, Australia?" Problem solved.

(Yes I know about the article that claims this would be bad, and I disagree with it.)

Agree, I should have put that in the range of possible solutions. That said, while people who understand geometry, geology, and science & math in general will find it best, the majority who do not would likely object...

Clocks are clocks, let's not try to pretend they're calendars.

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