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Comment by autoexec | Hacker News Reader

Apps that tempt people into placing their mental health issues, and the state of those issues, into networked devices designed to collect and leak their private data like a sieve is just irresponsible. I'm sure advertisers and data brokers would love to have this kind of information, but it's probably better for people who already have struggles with mental health if companies aren't exploiting those struggles for profit.

Even if you don't plan on selling that data, it's operating on a platform that can't be trusted and is itself designed to exploit users.

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Also, an anxious person won’t use this app if there is any chance of his data leaking outside. For example, I couldn’t start my personal calendar until I found a way to have it 100% locally via Obsidian plugin.

People are anxious about different things. Most anxious people aren’t anxious about data privacy and security.

Apart from having your data locally hosted on your phone, what else would put your mind at ease?

I don't understand why you're being downvoted. This is absolutely an issue of today's mobile devices.

I suspect that at least a few people here earn a living by working on apps designed to collect detailed information about the mental health issues of users and they'd rather not be reminded of the fact that all of that data is being/will be used against those same users at every opportunity for the rest of their lives.

I understand the frustration and mistrust with things like this. I don't know if I can answer every qualm on here. Because honestly, most of them are valid and have examples of companies that have mishandled our data. That being said, I'll say a few things.

1. I will not sell people's mental health data. As someone who has struggled with Social Anxiety (the fear of being judged), the last thing I want is my personal life made public or revealed without my consent.

2. I think this does deserve some eye-roll, since many people say they won't do that at the beginning. But after spending a lot of my life struggling with hiding stuff, there's not a monetary value that could make me do that to someone else.

3. I'm also not really a fan of advertising. I plan on charging for features people actually find valuable. Some people will probably get angry at that too, but a price tag upfront means I don't need to sell you (and your data) behind your back.

There's always a cost to things. I plan on being painfully upfront.

I truly appreciate your comment though. I know going forward that I'll need to be very clear about privacy and data governance to put people at ease. And then, actually stick to what I say.

I'm curious though, are you talking about Apple as the platform that can't be trusted?

Maybe touching some grass and freeing yourself from these shackles would actually improve your life? Constantly worrying if some data is gathered you that could be used to gasp better target advertisements for you probably is affecting that mental state a lot more than you can to admit.

You can go to absurd lengths to try and tie down your data, but at the end of the day your data isn't that interesting. Just run adblocking software and you are set.

This is nonsense. I’ve had to deal with bills coming in my name because someone got hold of my credit card and address. It’s absolutely stressful and will make you feel helpless. What about people denied insurance because of their Amazon purchases? People with bad mental health being harassed because their data leaked? Doxxing, iCloud hack photo leaks, people affected by leaks of key government IDs, etc.; how are you even suggesting that one shouldn’t worry about their data getting in the wrong hands? What kind of happy feel-good reality do you live in… Ads are the least of one’s concerns when it comes to your personal data.

>I’ve had to deal with bills coming in my name because someone got hold of my credit card and address.

If you can't distinguish between stolen credit card and whatever mental things this app is tracking, what can I say?

That’s not the point. Data being misused or falling into the wrong hands absolutely has a toll on you. If an abused credit card number hurt me that much while I was fighting depression, anything more sensitive can be even worse.

> Constantly worrying if some data is gathered you that could be used to gasp better target advertisements for you probably is affecting that mental state a lot more than you can to admit.

You're either confused or grossly misinformed. It's never been just about showing you ads.

The data collected about you can and will will be used against you in countless other ways. Data brokers sell your info to employers, landlords, and insurance companies. Your private data can be used against you in courtrooms, in divorce proceedings, in custody battles. The data apps collect can get you arrested or make you a suspect for crimes you had nothing to do with (or are only crimes in other states).

Companies are increasingly using your private data to determine everything from how much to charge you vs the next person for the same goods/services, to decide what they'll tell you their policies are vs what they'll tell someone else, and even how long to leave you waiting on hold when you call them.

The data being collected and sold about you never goes away. It will follow you for the rest of your life. You aren't allowed to know who has it, or what they are doing with it, or how accurate it is. You can never know what will prejudice someone against you and what is acceptable today may not be tomorrow.

If you think the data being collected about you is all about what ads you see, then you clearly haven't been paying attention. There is a multi-billion dollar a year industry around the buying and selling the most mundane details of your personal life because not only is your data "interesting", it's making people money hand over fist at your expense.

>Data brokers sell your info to employers, landlords, and insurance companies.

Even if this was the case, why is this an issue? Why would you want to work for employer who cared about anything except your skills? Same goes for landlords (not that you should be renting anyway). And get a better insurance company.

Do you believe that this app has been designed to leak users private data and exploit its users?

I didn't even see a privacy policy (not that those are in any way binding), but even it isn't doing that today who knows what will happen to the data they're collecting/have collected in the future, and like I said, smart phones aren't secure or private and they are designed to exploit users.

If you need help with your mental health, please talk to a medical professional where you have at least some measure of protection under the law instead of handing real-time records of your struggles and vulnerabilities over to under-regulated companies looking to prey on you by using that very same information.

It's a shame that it is this way. These apps can provide immense value, but due to under-regulation we cannot consume these apps with comfort.

New user-protection laws in areas like mental health are strongly needed.

Hm, they do collect user and usage data and they say they might share it with others.

https://www.roadmaptogrow.com/privacy.html

It's unfortunate. We’ve made a similar app (to combat sugar addiction), but we made a conscious decision to avoid collecting any information we don't have to.

Our privacy policy is just that we get the data App Store shares with us and that when a user sends us an email we are going to keep that email.

> We’ve made a similar app (to combat sugar addiction), but we made a conscious decision to avoid collecting any information we don't have to.

That was intriguing to me (especially the respectful data collection). Found the app through your profile, but it’s not available in my country.

Yes, currently I need to sign some new agreement because Apple changed the terms and put it back on App Store. I will try to remember and let you know, thanks for the interest.

Hey. This is a good callout. Honestly, I should have done more due diligence with generating privacy policies before this. I do not have any plans to sell user's data. I wrote my full thoughts on that in my reply to the top comment.

But we do store data in the cloud and use analytics to understand usage data. So technically, I am disclosing certain data with those companies.

* first name

* the type of step you took (ex. Commenting on a social media post)

* email address

The data that is collected is to understand how people are using the app, if it's helping them overcome Social Anxiety, and to contact them for stuff.

This thread has made me realize that I need to re-work the privacy policy. Most policies are made to be pretty unclear and actually obfuscate what will actually be done with data. I hate reading those and just want to know:

* What data is collected & why

* Where it's being sent

If anyone has other concerns, you can drop me a line at teeoh@roadmaptogrow.com. I am quite committed to being upfront with this -- even if people don't like the all of the policy.

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