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Comment by ajross | Hacker News Reader

That's always the refuge: you're interested in equality alone. But it's really not true, because (if you're being honest with yourself) you reacted emotionally, not logically, and enough so that you decided to post on the internet about it to let everyone else know how you feel.

It's just an article about a notable subgroup. Would you be annoyed if it was (as another poster amusingly points out below) Minnesotan or Indian founders? Local Texan sons done good out west? University of Subterranean Boston alumni notes? It's clear you're peeved because, for whatever reason, you don't like "identity politics" and you pigeonholed this as being an example.

Well, get over yourself. It's not. It's about women with startups. Being underrepresented (wildly so, relative to the population) I think women constitute a "notable" subgroup. You don't?

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Hi thank you for taking the time to read my answers.

Well as a matter of fact I really answered rationally... Well at least I hope I did. If you want to read my real motivation, beyond the immediate answer here it is: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3779310

I am French, and I tell you what, I'd just HATE an article that would say "Some French that are really good in tech.". I want to be integrated in the society, I want people to simply ignore my country of origin, I'm not ashamed it's just not relevant to the fact that I am an engineer or an entrepreneur, just as being a women, black, chinese or anything different than white american male!

I was nodding my head to ajross's little armchair analysis but when you said you were French a little light bulb went off.

This is just hearsay and stray recollections of things I've read, but doesn't France, officially at least, have a very different approach to equality than the US? I believe that it is illegal in France to recognize racial or gender differences in official contexts, is that true? This might cause a French person to view such an article as in bad taste and as an impediment to equality.

In the US there is long history of affirmative action and other remedial measures and I think the current culture reflects that. When you have a group as underrepresented as women in tech are, then the tendency is to try to boost them by whatever means necessary. Being an American I tend to agree with this approach but I can see the opposite side.

I guess you could ask what is the effect of articles like these? Are they doing more good by encouraging people to view women in tech as an accepted fact or are they entrenching the status quo by calling it out as it if were something special? I think the former effect outweighs the latter.

Edit: the lightbulb went on, not off. ;)

As you say in France we are taught not to see the differences. Indeed it is illegal to recognize any racial differences (gender differences are accepted in most scenarios ). You cannot be asked what is your ethnicity when you apply for a job. When I say to my american friends that I don't "see" color they don't believe me and they call it a racist thoughts. Months passing I realize that apparently very few people in the US want true equality, they want their own version with gender/ race specific advantages to fight the unfairness of history, which is very real.

As for the effects, I personally don't have the answer either, even if I try to draft possible outcomes (in another comment in this thread taking the finnish school example). From what I have read in the tech crunch article the encouragement had a weird effect in the Y Combinator selection: they may have managed to introduce "femininity" in tech but not "women". As somebody pointed out in another comment none of the women are technical founders...

But thanks for staying open minded, I believe that's how solutions are found: everybody listen to each other and a better understanding begin to take shape after a while, hopefully my indigenous perspective will help :).

Equality is still the goal, or it is supposed to be. It's not quite fair to say that very few people want true equality. They are aware of the circumstances in which they live and they are aware of history (to varying degrees for both, of course).

Like I said, I favor the American approach but I cannot say for sure which is better. Racism is far from gone in France according to my French acquaintances. Job applications may not ask your authenticity but I am told having the right type of name is often very valuable. Of course, once it comes to personal interviews it doesn't matter so much what is on the application.

I believe when some government departments collect demographic information they are also not allowed to collect ethnic information.

Public culture (in the media) in France does seem much more homogenous to me than in the US.

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